Semaphore Signals

[IrishPeter]

The S&CLR is going to need some signalling eventually, so my mind has turned to semaphores. I have a pretty clear idea of what I need, but has anyone had a go at scratch building them. As the SCLR is a slightly down at heel concern immaculate MacKenzie and Holland equipment is a bit too ritzy for us.

As far as I can figure it out a fixed distant is a doddle - tapered post - arm with spec glass -ladder - done! Home and starter sigs a bit more complicate due to the double spec glasses, and the need to counterbalance the arm, but still relatively simple - in theory...

Or am I missing something?

Any trips?

Cheers,
Peter in AZ

[Annie]

Tatty old Hornby tinplate '0' gauge signals recycle well as 16mm scale signals. The things are waaaaaay oversize for 0 or even gauge 1, but great for garden railways.

[IrishPeter]

That's a thought. My mother's old tinplate train set (yes, you did read right - mother) had a couple of them and they were huge by 7mm scale standards.

Are they lower quadrant or heretical? - I cannae remember which.

Peter in AZ

[Annie]

Properly and sensibly lower quadrant Peter

I like the sound of your Mum, I had tinplate trainsets too when I was a kiddie.

[IrishPeter]

Yeah - she's nuts in a good way.  So is my missus

My grandfather is still building boats at 91, so go figure...

Peter in AZ

[hussra]

Are they lower quadrant or heretical? - I cannae remember which.

Lower quadrant. (Of course, there were a very small number of heretical upper quadrant signals in Ireland!)

To be honest, most of the Irish NG lines do seem to have been signalled with tolerably nice equipment. Not lavish or elaborate at all (and often worked from open ground frames rather than even the most modest signal cabin), but ordinary signals built by reputable contractors from across the water (at the expense of the local ratepayers, of course).

They subsequently fell into a fair degree of ruination in many cases, but it seems to be they generally started from a tolerably good position.

The line whose signals I long to model would be the SLNCR, which had some fantastically home-made and home-modified structures, especially out in the sticks for level crossings and the like. Probably a lot of that is to do with it having been built well before the light railway building spree (and hence before "modern" semaphore signalling really came together) but without the money to comprehensively upgrade subsequently.

[TommyDodd]

As far as I can figure it out a fixed distant is a doddle - tapered post - arm with spec glass -ladder - done!

They could even be simpler than that. Some lines just used their standard signals without down-rod or other bits needed to make it move, to keep everything do-able from their existing parts bin, but others were more creative. The arm could simply be screwed or nailed to the post with no castings at all (I've seen this done). Likewise you don't necessarily need to have a spectacle plate- it was not unknown for the bullseye lens on the signal lamp to be dyed yellow (or red in your case) instead. With the combination of fixed arm and coloured lens you can choose which side of the post to mount the lamp, the conventional position or behind the arm, shining through a hole drilled therein.

As you're modelling Irish practice, things are a little different. As yellow distant arms didn't come in until the 20s (IE after independence) they never happened in the 26 Counties so arms should remain red and spectacle plates red/green. White stripe should be a chevron rather than a straight stripe or dot, though. There were various methods used to differentiate distants by night which might be entertaining to contemplate. The Furness used gas lights and somehow made theirs flash, some Indian lines using British equipment mounted the distant arm several feet down from the top of the post, leaving space for a fixed green light above the arm (where the lamp would be for a slotted home if it was there). Offhand I don't know if any of these were tried in the Free State, but it's your railway.

 Home and starter sigs a bit more complicate due to the double spec glasses, and the need to counterbalance the arm, but still relatively simple - in theory...

Or am I missing something?

Any tips?

Cheers,
Peter in AZ

It's a misconception that LQ signals were somehow not quite as fail-safe as UQ. Properly made, they had a lightweight wood (or pressed steel arm) and a solid cast spectacle plate so still had to be "pulled off" and would return to danger if the wire broke. They were traditionally operated by a down-rod pushing on the spectacle plate, rather than a wire, and the weight of this had to be factored into the counterbalancing. The only situation in which LQ posed a risk was heavy snow and icing- a solid block of ice forming on the arm could drag it down into the 'off' position.

[IrishPeter]

My home turf in Lincolnshire was LQ into British Railways days.  The LNER then BR would install UQ signals if they replaced an installation, but it was very slow going.

<geek alert>
I seem to recall that the pressure to replace LQ with UQ started after the Abbot's Ripton disaster, which, IIRC was a rear ender in a snow storm.  
</geek alert>

The railway I know most about - the Isle of Man Railway - has been using LQ signals since 1873 without too many problems.  Just to add to the fun they have recently reinstalled an old slotted post as the up signal at Castletown, though whether one would call it a home signal or a distant is up for grabs as the IMR only uses distants at Douglas, which has been resignalled twice - 1892 and 1981. The IMR places the signal a couple of hundred yards short of the station to give adequate braking distance for a slow moving train.  Usually the sighting is good enough that one can go from full tilt (25-30mph) to stop before reaching the loop or gates being protected. For the new slotted post, he Supporters Association paid for the new wood work, and the iron came from stores.  It will be commissioned this winter.

Peter in AZ

[IrishPeter]

I have ended up with the notion that the Skebawn and Castleknox should have a modest signalling installation..  The loop at Aussolas would need a home at each end to protect the loop, and the two temini something to stop an incoming train from crashing into anything already there.  Authorization to enter a block would be given by the stationmaster's right of way, and possession f the staff or a ticket having been shown the staff. As a result I am coming up with a minimum of four home signals - two for Aussolas, and one each for Castleknox and Skebawn. I have not looked into the level crossing issue yet, but as this is a Tramway, and the line was built pre-Armagh, the reguations are a bit looser than they were post-1889.

Sound OK?

Peter in AZ