Buying a 3D printer

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ge_rik
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Re: Buying a 3D printer

Post by ge_rik » Tue Sep 21, 2021 10:59 am

1mm seems a very large gap to me - the height should be no more than the thickness of a sheet of paper.
I'm sure you've probably already tried this but there are a few videos on YouTube about bed levelling specific to the Ender 3 - eg - https://youtu.be/_EfWVUJjBdA
This chap seems to know what he's talking about.

It does sound as if you're having more of a problem than should normally be the case. Once the bed has been levelled, it does get easier - I promise... :lol:
If you're still running into problems I could pop round to see my mate who has an Ender 3 to see if he has any specific advice.

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Re: Buying a 3D printer

Post by philipy » Tue Sep 21, 2021 11:30 am

GAP wrote:
Tue Sep 21, 2021 8:29 am

Z axis end stop was adjusted 3 times so nozzle was about 1mm above plate.
The "leveling" with the printer paper was done at least 10 times, I spent nearly 2 hours trying to get a print started.
I think there is your problem. My m/c (Qidi) came with a thin piece of plastic on which is printed "Levelling paper". I've just checked with micrometer and it is 0.25mm thick, so your 1mm sounds very much too high. For reference a piece of Tesco best printer paper came in at 0.11mm. The major cause of print problems I've found, is getting that gap right. Too big and you get spaghetti, too small and it smears and even drags the nozzle on the bed.
GAP wrote:
Tue Sep 21, 2021 8:29 am
The bed was preheated to 60C with nozzle at 200C, a setting in the Ender "prepare" menu
Thats sounds fine for PLA in my experience.
GAP wrote:
Tue Sep 21, 2021 8:29 am
The bed seems to be closer than 1mm to the plate.
As I've said above, but you need to know what it is. Find a piece of 0.25mm plasticard and use that.
GAP wrote:
Tue Sep 21, 2021 8:29 am
If I adjust one side of the plate till it is "just right" when I move over to the other side the nozzle hits the plate till I adjust the opposite side, the same for the front to back adjustment.
I just go round and round and adjust each one in turn over and over as any change of one screw throws out all the others.
I think there was some discussion of this a couple of weeks back. If memory serves, you have 4 levelling screws on the Ender? I only have 3, which brings its own problems but they are different to a 4 screw version, so I can't really suggest the best way to tackle it.

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Re: Buying a 3D printer

Post by GAP » Tue Sep 21, 2021 9:14 pm

Trevor Thompson wrote:
Tue Sep 21, 2021 9:28 am
-steves- wrote:
Mon Sep 20, 2021 1:12 pm
GAP wrote:
Fri Sep 17, 2021 6:48 am
The Ender has come!!!

I have finally taken delivery of an Ender 3 V2, I had to wait till stocks arrived to fill my pre order.

I am slowly assembling it and should be up and running next week, if life would just stop getting in the road.

My first prints will probably some LGB type bogies, I found some stl files on Thingaverse, to replace the home made ones I have on 6 wagons at present.

I am thinking of using ABS filament.

Does anybody know what type of filament comes in the box with the printer?
It is standard PLA in the box. As you have an Ender 3, it is not enclosed and you may have issues printing with ABS. Trevor on here loves the stuff but that isn't the case for most of us, it is a bit of a black art to print with ABS, especially for first prints. I would go with the PLA to start and see how you get on and then decide. Just my point of view :thumbup:
I don't know anything about types of printer other than the one I have. But printing with ABS requires specific conditions: bed plate heated to 100 degrees C, extruder at 230 degrees, and a FULLY enclosed build area. I suggest that the printer you have is not suitable for printing ABS.

Trevor
There are 2 preheat settings on the Ender3 V2 PLA and ABS which is why I am looking at ABS
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Re: Buying a 3D printer

Post by -steves- » Wed Sep 22, 2021 5:24 pm

GAP wrote:
Tue Sep 21, 2021 9:14 pm

There are 2 preheat settings on the Ender3 V2 PLA and ABS which is why I am looking at ABS
Yes it has the preheat settings, as does my Ender 5 and my Ender 6 (the 6 is a mainly enclosed printer) but I still wouldn't go with ABS as they are not FULLY enclosed. Just stick with PLA or PLA+ for now (I always use PLA+) and if you want more, then try PETG and see how you get on with that.

As mentioned, the first layer height is absolutely critical for everything.
The buck stops here .......

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Re: Buying a 3D printer

Post by -steves- » Wed Sep 22, 2021 5:29 pm

Also it can be worth winding the levelling screws down tighter before you do the levelling as the board can move otherwise.

Never had an Ender 3 myself, but I am assuming you have to set the Z offset like the Ender 5 and then save the settings?
The buck stops here .......

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Re: Buying a 3D printer

Post by GAP » Wed Sep 22, 2021 9:38 pm

-steves- wrote:
Wed Sep 22, 2021 5:29 pm
Also it can be worth winding the levelling screws down tighter before you do the levelling as the board can move otherwise.

Never had an Ender 3 myself, but I am assuming you have to set the Z offset like the Ender 5 and then save the settings?
I did read somewhere about tightening the screw, think it was on here, I will attempt to start over again using some of the suggestions.
A couple of screw knobs seem to have no resistance to turning unlike other that have some tension.
The bed may need cleaning as it has just had the protective sheet removed and that may have left some residue.

There is a Z axis offset setting but I have not touched it (set to 0) as I do not know what it does.
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Re: Buying a 3D printer

Post by GAP » Wed Sep 22, 2021 9:39 pm

-steves- wrote:
Wed Sep 22, 2021 5:24 pm
GAP wrote:
Tue Sep 21, 2021 9:14 pm

There are 2 preheat settings on the Ender3 V2 PLA and ABS which is why I am looking at ABS
Yes it has the preheat settings, as does my Ender 5 and my Ender 6 (the 6 is a mainly enclosed printer) but I still wouldn't go with ABS as they are not FULLY enclosed. Just stick with PLA or PLA+ for now (I always use PLA+) and if you want more, then try PETG and see how you get on with that.

As mentioned, the first layer height is absolutely critical for everything.
Have not heard of PLA+ so another bit of research required.
Talk about the dark side being challenging. :shock:
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Re: Buying a 3D printer

Post by GAP » Thu Sep 23, 2021 6:03 am

There be 3D prints here!!!

After looking at some more youtube videos I have successfully 'leveled' the bed and adjusted the Z axis offset (0.1 for one and 0.13 for the other) for the printer and have successfully printed the 2 test prints that came with the printer on an SD card.

Next step along the path to the dark side is to;
  • 'slice' the .stl files that I have in Tinkercad using the Creality Slicer that came with the printer
  • then transfer them to an SD card
  • then to start printing a bogie for a wagon
How hard can this be????? :( :(
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Re: Buying a 3D printer

Post by Jimmyb » Thu Sep 23, 2021 7:56 am

GAP wrote:
Thu Sep 23, 2021 6:03 am
  • then to start printing a bogie for a wagon
How hard can this be????? :( :(
It's a simple one line comment, so must be easy ;)

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Re: Buying a 3D printer

Post by Lonsdaler » Thu Sep 23, 2021 4:52 pm

GAP wrote:
Thu Sep 23, 2021 6:03 am
There be 3D prints here!!!

After looking at some more youtube videos I have successfully 'leveled' the bed and adjusted the Z axis offset (0.1 for one and 0.13 for the other) for the printer and have successfully printed the 2 test prints that came with the printer on an SD card.

Next step along the path to the dark side is to;
  • 'slice' the .stl files that I have in Tinkercad using the Creality Slicer that came with the printer
  • then transfer them to an SD card
  • then to start printing a bogie for a wagon
How hard can this be????? :( :(
You do realise that half of the 'not yet got a 3d printer' forum members are following your progress before making the leap themselves? No pressure :lol:
Phil

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Re: Buying a 3D printer

Post by Peter Butler » Thu Sep 23, 2021 6:45 pm

On the other hand it has just proved to me what a complete nightmare it all is and that I have been correct in my decision all along not to buy one!
The best things in life are free.... so why am I doing this?

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Re: Buying a 3D printer

Post by philipy » Thu Sep 23, 2021 7:30 pm

Peter Butler wrote:
Thu Sep 23, 2021 6:45 pm
On the other hand it has just proved to me what a complete nightmare it all is and that I have been correct in my decision all along not to buy one!
You won't be surprised that I totally disagree, Peter :lol:
Like anything else, it takes a bit of practice to get to grips with something new and of course sometimes it never does turn out satisfactorily. Something that you find very easy and I always have trouble with, is paint mixing to get the right colour. I've been trying to crack that particular technique for about 60 odd years with little or no success but I keep trying! :D

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Re: Buying a 3D printer

Post by GAP » Thu Sep 23, 2021 9:51 pm

philipy wrote:
Thu Sep 23, 2021 7:30 pm
Peter Butler wrote:
Thu Sep 23, 2021 6:45 pm
On the other hand it has just proved to me what a complete nightmare it all is and that I have been correct in my decision all along not to buy one!
You won't be surprised that I totally disagree, Peter :lol:
Like anything else, it takes a bit of practice to get to grips with something new and of course sometimes it never does turn out satisfactorily. Something that you find very easy and I always have trouble with, is paint mixing to get the right colour. I've been trying to crack that particular technique for about 60 odd years with little or no success but I keep trying! :D
I have to agree after the bad day on Tuesday, I had some 1:1 train therapy on Wednesday and yesterday (Thursday) I started right from the beginning again.
I looked at some other videos before starting to get other opinions and found one that described how to do the Z stop adjustment a different way. After that the bed leveling went smoothly and the test prints were a success.
I guess I was living up to Einstein's description of insanity “Insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results.”

My next step is mastering the slicer and starting a print for a bogie.
Graeme from the home of the Ringbalin Light Railway
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Re: Buying a 3D printer

Post by GAP » Thu Sep 23, 2021 10:15 pm

-steves- wrote:
Wed Sep 22, 2021 5:29 pm
Also it can be worth winding the levelling screws down tighter before you do the levelling as the board can move otherwise.

Never had an Ender 3 myself, but I am assuming you have to set the Z offset like the Ender 5 and then save the settings?
Regarding the springs this is one of the videos I watched and the person recommended replacing the springs with a different type that do not buckle under compression to improve efficiency.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4JSa_r8xgX8

This is the other and again compressing the springs was recommended.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ypb1OUII9Nw

I used the method in the top video to set the z axis switch and a combination of both to level the bed.

I adjusted the z offset after watching the print quality and on the 2 items I printed (the dog and cat that came presliced on the printers SD card) and adjust accordingly, 0.1 and 0.13 respectively, to get a smooth print.

My other big mistake was I started printing immediately instead of letting the bed and nozzle temperatures stabilise, applying a bit of patience instead jumping in boots and all and things just started to work.

I did notice that when the print started a line was laid down on the extreme edge of the bed before the nozzle moved to the centre, I am guessing that this is to get the filament ready to print.

Update;
When I went to Jaycar to buy some filament they have a Creality Dual Filament 3D Printer CR-X and it has the recommended springs fitted, guessing Creality have upgrade to these type of springs.
Last edited by GAP on Fri Sep 24, 2021 10:16 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Buying a 3D printer

Post by philipy » Fri Sep 24, 2021 7:06 am

GAP wrote:
Thu Sep 23, 2021 10:15 pm

My other big mistake was I started printing immediately instead of letting the bed and nozzle temperatures stabilise, applying a bit of patience instead jumping in boots and all and things just started to work.


I did notice that when the print started a line was laid down on the extreme edge of the bed before the nozzle moved to the centre, I am guessing that this is to get the filament ready to print.
I'm surprised your m/c programming allows the print to start before the temps stabilise - I'm no expert but I wonder if your G Code is a bit corrupted?
With my m/c I press start and it does all sorts of moving to check/set the bed height and x & y zero's, etc, before the head moves to the front left corner for a couple of minutes and sits there with the filament slowly oozing as the nozzle temp increases, and at the same ltime the display shows the bed temp also increasing. Only when both are within operating limits does the head move back to the bed and then it first lays down a long line the full length and half a return length of the front edge of the bed before moving over to start actually printing.

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