Shannon creek timber mill tramway

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Shannon creek timber mill tramway

Post by Steaminnthnsw » Tue Dec 11, 2018 4:45 am

Hello , after writing an indroduction a few months back and showing a few pics of my first live steam locomotive , a roundhouse lady Anne that I am doing some Australianising too, I’ve finally started constriction of my railway. I laid the first panel of track today, and have a pretty good plan in my head , and partially drawn on paper , of how it will all come together.
First , a bit about the location. I’m based just outside of Grafton in northern New South Wales, Australia .
A town famous for its jacaranda trees and the yearly festival that goes along with it.
scince the area was first settled two major industries have kept the area alive , and still do today.
That is sugar cane ( to the north side) , and logging just about everywhere else .
Slightly further south towards Coffs Harbour is also a booming capital for banana plantations.
Shannon creek timber mill will be built on our property , to the south west of Grafton , where many a bush timber mill was once located , and a few still operate today.
Our property is actually still used for timber harvesting once every 6-8 years , and is a bit over 100acres in size.
Stage one of the railway will have a small timber mill, and yard with loco shed and basic servicing facility’s . This will be built on a raised section made up of x3 sheets of 1200x2400 marine plywood that runs against the wall outside my 6m x 9m shed.
There will be a siding that allows rolling stock to be driven into a bench inside the shed for storage and repairs ect.
Once leaving the raised section it will take a 180 degree turn over a approx 3m radius that travels through a garden bed via a large timber bridge, and then runs down a fairly straight , 1 in 30 grade over a length of about 40 meters. Towards the bottom the line will duck and weave around a rockery , and over a small river, and eventually arrive at one logging site, with a passing loop. This is where it will terminate untill stage two is undertaken at a much later stage.
Locos will leave the mill yard running Smokebox first, and then once at the bottom will run around the train and travel bunker first for the return journey.
Today I have sunk galvanised steel posts into the ground along side my shed that will be supports for the raised section, and also provide mounting for a 7x5m canvas shade sail that will provide some relief from the blistering sun in summer, where temps can reach 45 degrees C.
I’ve also laid the first section of track at the bottom logging site.
I will attach some photos of my progress later tonight

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Re: Shannon creek timber mill tramway

Post by gregh » Tue Dec 11, 2018 5:55 am

Great to hear of your plans. You seem to have covered what I consider are the important ideas..
always have a stage 2 and stage 3 in the pipeline, so you know where you're going.
provide track into an inside location
provide shade for operators.
I would only add - have sidings at the front of your 'stations' to allow locos and trains to be put on the track easily.

look forward to pics.
Greg from downunder.
The Sandstone & Termite's website: https://members.optusnet.com.au/satr/satr.htm

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Re: Shannon creek timber mill tramway

Post by Steaminnthnsw » Tue Dec 11, 2018 7:31 am

Yeah. Where the track disappear into the shed will be disguised as an old disused loco shed, with junk scattered all around it and tracks sunken down into the dirt ect . But where that comes out is behind the main loco shed which is a simple , open wooden structure that has 3 lines going through and out into the yard on the other side. This leaves considerable room to be used as a steam up bay, and is about 1.5 meters off the ground, so a good working height for most. A handy shelf is being made to fit underneath that area for water, gas, oils , radios ect ect. Probably won’t have a lot of people coming to visit and run locos as there doses seem to be many people in my area who are into garden railways , and if there is and you’re reading this feel free to say hi! .
Just trying to resize a photo from today’s track laying effort / learning experience . I have a background in mechanical engineering and have worked on full-size 2ft gauge steam and diesel locos scince I was a teen ( I’m now 36 ) so looking after rolling stock isn’t a problem for me. However , this is my first experience building a garden railway and don’t really have anyone to guide me a whole lot , especially when it comes to track work, so any comments / suggestions would be greatly appreciated in this area.

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Re: Shannon creek timber mill tramway

Post by LNR » Tue Dec 11, 2018 7:35 am

Hi Dan,
Good to hear your moving along the construction path. A query, and in line with what Greg has
mentioned, those 1200 x 2400 sheets set against a wall would indicate a very long reach to rerail wagons etc
unless you only contemplate scenery at the back 600mm or so. My service area is only 600mm wide and at
about bar height, and that is a fair reach to set a wagon up or rerail one. Just wondering!
Looking forward to updates.
Grant.

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Re: Shannon creek timber mill tramway

Post by Steaminnthnsw » Tue Dec 11, 2018 7:44 am

You raise a good point. The reason for the size is too allow the track to make a 90 degree turn to enter the shed without having to use an extremely tight radius , and also, as you said, most of the further away parts are only scenery anyway. The timber mill will be placed at the back with the rail line that drops logs being about half the depth of the sheet of plywood. My wife is a keen Gardner and we are trying to find a way to plant some small plants as a backdrop of sorts in this area to disguise the sand coloured shed wall

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Re: Shannon creek timber mill tramway

Post by LNR » Tue Dec 11, 2018 7:53 am

Just to throw another idea into the mix, if you were able to leave anything like a 3-400mm gap between the wall and the ply, something grown in the ground or pots will seek the light and grow up and provide real tree backdrop. My raised track has hedging either side, and trimmed, it provides a softening look to it all.
Grant.

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Re: Shannon creek timber mill tramway

Post by Steaminnthnsw » Tue Dec 11, 2018 8:09 am

LNR wrote: Tue Dec 11, 2018 7:53 am Just to throw another idea into the mix, if you were able to leave anything like a 3-400mm gap between the wall and the ply, something grown in the ground or pots will seek the light and grow up and provide real tree backdrop. My raised track has hedging either side, and trimmed, it provides a softening look to it all.
Grant.
That’s actually an idea me and the wife discussed yesterday . I also thought about fabricating stainless steel “pots” that are in fact more like a long trench shaped channel to plant into. They can sit in a gap between the back edge of the plywood and shed, as you suggested

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Re: Shannon creek timber mill tramway

Post by Steaminnthnsw » Tue Dec 11, 2018 10:12 am

Ok, following two photos show my track laying effort today. Quick disclaimer - I have no bloody idea how to do track work, I’ve just seen bits and peices of how other have done it and thought I’d give it a try, so here it goes.
First , I found some old pavers that my wife’s grandmother had stashed up behind the feed sheds, so I went and stole them.
Next, I dug a trench the approximate width and depth of the pavers. I thought about mabey Putting some fine rock, or road base in the bottom of the trench to assist with drainage , but I didn’t have any on hand , and didn’t feel like driving all the way to town to get some , so stuff it, I went without . Besides , it is pretty rocky ground anyway and drains pretty good when we have storms. I then laid the pavers in place, carefully packing them Down and trying my best to level them all as best I could. I filled in around the pavers with soil once I had done .
I gave it a bit of water and left it overnight to settle . Not sure if these actually helps or not.
Today I drilled into the pavers and bashed in rawl plugs ( don’t know what they are called over in the UK ) which allows me to screw the track too the pavers. I then took a bucket and tipped in dry , 50/50 concrete and dry sand and gave it a mix around. I tipped it dry onto the tracks and spread it around using an old paintbrush, once again donated ( stolen ) from nannies shed. I then gently watered the mixture in using a weed sprayer bottle/ handpiece to make sure it was a nice fine mist and not washing any of the mixture away. It ended up with good coverage , but the colour was poo poo..
I decided to try taking Some of the sandy soil from my dirt driveway and spread it over the top and water it in too add some colour and texture too it. The last photo is taken while it was still wet. It’s now dryed well and hard as a rock, and I’ve swept away those larger pebbles you can see in the photo and it looks pretty good I think. Will take another photo tomorrow when it’s dry again because it just started to rain here as I’m typing this
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Re: Shannon creek timber mill tramway

Post by LNR » Tue Dec 11, 2018 11:10 am

Dan,
Remember if your laying track with our summer temperatures about to hit, to allow gaps for expansion.
Personally I don't like to see track tied down too much, being a mix of plastic and metal (I'm guessing
yours is Aluminium!) it needs to move and if tied down somethings got to give. All my ground level track
only had two screw fastenings, and I removed those years ago.
Grant.

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Re: Shannon creek timber mill tramway

Post by Steaminnthnsw » Tue Dec 11, 2018 5:34 pm

Im using Peco flex track that has nickel steel rail. There is only two screws per length holding it down, one right at the join, and one half way along. But I did notice once the concrete mixture had set it actually holds the tack very firmly by itself .

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Re: Shannon creek timber mill tramway

Post by tom_tom_go » Tue Dec 11, 2018 5:38 pm

Looks good, cover the screws though. :thumbup:

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Re: Shannon creek timber mill tramway

Post by Steaminnthnsw » Tue Dec 11, 2018 7:47 pm

Yeah, planning on it . Everything was still wet when this pic was taken

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Re: Shannon creek timber mill tramway

Post by Steaminnthnsw » Wed Dec 12, 2018 12:57 am

Here’s a question for those with a bit more experience than me when it comes to track laying. Instead of using pavers or brick, could I use a H4 treated pine Batton or something similar ? Mabey win added protection of a coating of sump oil like I do with fence posts before I put them in the ground ?
H4 treated pine is supposed to be good for 15 years when in contact with ground as far as I know.
My reasoning for this is it would be a lot quicker to lay track nice and level this way . It’s pretty time consuming packing and leveling each paver trying to get it just right.
Thoughts ?

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Re: Shannon creek timber mill tramway

Post by LNR » Wed Dec 12, 2018 2:26 am

Have you considered just laying it straight on levelled ground, and if you want to fasten it 4" flat head
nails or galv. wire sort of mini tent pegs. Would your ground be ironstone? looks a bit like it in the photo.
Trouble with timber down here it might not rot too readily in the ground but it can twist and bow. I'm
on sand here and all ground level track laid directly on the ground.
Decisions, decisions,
Grant.

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Re: Shannon creek timber mill tramway

Post by Steaminnthnsw » Wed Dec 12, 2018 2:34 am

Yeah, I didn’t consider the warping/ twisting part. Figured if it had been properly seasoned that wouldn’t be an issue , but having said that it may absorb moisture from the ground I guess and may cause it too warp.
I’m mainly using flex track so I think I still need to anchor it , even if it’s only while the concrete sets.
mabey I will try the nails idea and see how it goes.

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Re: Shannon creek timber mill tramway

Post by LNR » Wed Dec 12, 2018 3:04 am

My track is all AMS Flextrack code 250 in 5ft. lengths. Makes for nice curves and transition into them.
Curves are where you'll find the most movement, you can have short or long straights but all the longtitudinal expansion goes to the curves and in our summer heat it can be quite substantial. You mention a long straight on a 1:40 grade, a long sweeping curve adds a more pleasing point photographically, and helps ease the large expansion at the end of it. From a timber tramway point of view most lines were pretty curvy on account of terrain.
Just some thoughts.
Grant.

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Re: Shannon creek timber mill tramway

Post by Steaminnthnsw » Wed Dec 12, 2018 3:13 am

The first half of the grade has to be some what straight due to fence lines , diveway ect, but once it gets down to about knee height the plant life will thicken and there is some large rocks ect to negotiate around so will produce some nice curves and allow the track to disappear from sight in places which also adds realisim and makes for nicer photographs

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Re: Shannon creek timber mill tramway

Post by ge_rik » Wed Dec 12, 2018 8:15 am

Steaminnthnsw wrote: Tue Dec 11, 2018 10:12 am ........
Today I drilled into the pavers and bashed in rawl plugs ( don’t know what they are called over in the UK ) ........
I call them rawl plugs. A bit like the way we call all vacuum cleaners Hoovers regardless of who makes them. :?

Rik
PS I don't think we've turned rawl plug into a verb (eg rawl plugging) in the way we use Hoover as a verb (ie Hoovering)
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Re: Shannon creek timber mill tramway

Post by philipy » Wed Dec 12, 2018 9:13 am

ge_rik wrote: Wed Dec 12, 2018 8:15 am
I call them rawl plugs. A bit like the way we call all vacuum cleaners Hoovers regardless of who makes them. :?

Rik
PS I don't think we've turned rawl plug into a verb (eg rawl plugging) in the way we use Hoover as a verb (ie Hoovering)
Me too. ( here we go again...! :lol: )
Philip

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Re: Shannon creek timber mill tramway

Post by Steaminnthnsw » Wed Dec 12, 2018 9:59 am

Is that the same way you guys call all escavators JCB’s ?

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