NWNG Cleminson

River Lin · Post by **River Lin** » Mon Jun 22, 2015 11:22 pm

Hi all.
The latest addition to my vintage NWNG/WHR stable will be a Cleminson inspired all 3rd coach of 1877. I have completed the basics of the underframe which I need to try out on a line I will be visiting at the weekend and have made a start on the coach sides.

The original coach had external framing with panelling added to the inside. To allow panels and glazing to be added to my model I needed the frame timber to include rebates and so made up a jig to cut these rebates in 3mm square hardwood using small hand tools. I can show how I made this jig if anyone would like me to.

Frame timber showing rebates for glazing and panelling on the coach inside.

View showing my interpretation of the Cleminson system of allowing a long 6 wheel coach to negotiate curves more easily. Although I understand this does not look like the original would have done, I need a much more flexible system due to some garden lines I visit having tighter than prototypical curves and also reverse curves through sets of points (turnouts) etc. I have used brass rod but I can change this to thinner steel wire if I need more spring in the system.
If I find this works well I will add dummy axle boxes to give more realism.

Post by **ge_rik** » Tue Jun 23, 2015 5:53 am

I like the pivoting system, David. Looks simple but effective. Being a great fan of the Southwold, I've always fancied the idea of constructing a Cleminson coach (or coal wagon) but never had the courage to try. I'll be interested to see progress.

Rik

ikcdab · Post by **ikcdab** » Tue Jun 23, 2015 8:42 am

Looks really good. Is the centre truck held in at all or is it free to move up and down and only restrained by the brass rod?
So if you turned the chassis up the right way, the centre truck would drop out?

MDLR · Post by **MDLR** » Tue Jun 23, 2015 2:16 pm

Would you consider writing this up for SMT?[/i]

River Lin · Post by **River Lin** » Tue Jun 23, 2015 3:01 pm

Hi Ikedab.
At present yes the centre axle can slide out on its waxed plate to allow for fettling and adjustments. In the finished coach i intend it to be up inside the solebars so held in place but removeable if necessary. D.

River Lin · Post by **River Lin** » Tue Jun 23, 2015 7:52 pm

Hi again ikcdab
I have just reread your last post and I think I misunderstood the question. Although as I said, the centre axle can slide out sideways at the moment, it will not drop onto the track as it runs in 'L' shaped runners. By adjusting the height of the coach floor on the axles at either end by using waxed shims I can set the centre axle unit to run without rubbing on the underside of the floor. The following photo might make this more clear. D.

ikcdab · Post by **ikcdab** » Tue Jun 23, 2015 9:38 pm

Many thanks, that explains it very well.

River Lin · Post by **River Lin** » Thu Jul 02, 2015 10:54 pm

Update July 2nd.
Hi all.
Progress is slow due to grandparenting duties. Who said retirement would bring lots of free time? But, I have completed the framework for 1 side and made a start on the second. Cutting the rebates on the inside edges of the 3mm hardwood seems to be taking the most time but I want it to be right. Also there are many pieces that have to be exactly the same length such as the framework uprights and horizontal spacers.

I have also made modifications to the underframe.
I have arranged for the link points between the ends and middle axle to be closer to the middle axle so the end axles do not turn as much.
I have replaced the stiff brass rods with plastic coated flexible steel wire to allow for more flexibility on the curves. During testing at a Northamptonshire group garden railway meeting at the weekend it behaved as I had hoped. It was fascinating watching the centre axle disappearing from view on curves and coming into view again on the straight.

I can now think about dummy axle boxes for more realism though I am not sure what the would have originally looked like.
David.

River Lin · Post by **River Lin** » Fri Nov 06, 2015 10:06 pm

Hi all.
I have posted these photos elsewhere on this forum but I feel they should continue in this thread. Progress has been slow but here is one side with some panelling added and one door in place. Please bear in mind this is still in its rough state before any cleaning up.

And now with door open and droplight lowered.

I have just about completed the panelling and will try and post a photo tomorrow.

Further to my work on the underframe in the summer I have realised that the coach rides too high on the rails. It has been suggested that I could have an artificially high floor in the finished coach to give the impression of a lower coach. However, I obviously want to keep the floor level with the bottom of the opening door. I have some ideas to try.

David

River Lin · Post by **River Lin** » Wed Nov 18, 2015 1:52 pm

Hi all
Latest progress update.
Both sides complete with panelling and beading apart from glazing which will be after sanding, priming and painting. All four doors are now done with opening droplights. With doors 2-4 I made them with plenty of room for edge painting. It did not occur to me while making the 1st door a good fit in the frame that I need to allow for 2 or 3 layers of paint on the door edge and on the door frame. Doh.
It looks as though I may have to carefully plane the door edges later to allow them to fit when painted. (or make a new door) :-(
David

Post by **ge_rik** » Wed Nov 18, 2015 2:32 pm

Great work, David. Really impressed by the level of detail already evident. Would love a see some video of the chassis in action sometime.

Rik

River Lin · Post by **River Lin** » Wed Nov 18, 2015 5:29 pm

Hi Rik.
Thanks for those kind words but I have already started to modify the underframe as I have discovered that it rides too high as mentioned earlier in this thread. While doing this I might even try moving the centre axle using chains as per original. We shall see.

Soar Valley Light · Post by **Soar Valley Light** » Wed Nov 18, 2015 8:58 pm

That's a superb piece of work David. It looks beautiful, far too nice to paint!

Like Rik, I'd love to see the underframe.

IrishPeter · Post by **IrishPeter** » Thu Nov 19, 2015 12:09 am

Unless you can get them as tight as a schoolmistress' knicker elastic I would be wary of using chains for the linkage as they introduce too much flexibility into the structure - you only need it to flex when and where you need it to. I came somewhat unstuck with rubber bands because they proved to have too much give. In small scales, piano wire, I am told, works well.

FWIW, the Manx Northern Cleminsons have a pretty solid iron linkage between the wooden centre and outer sub-frames. Given how well the MNR Cleminsons held up - one or two were still in use in the early 50s - I am surprised the NWNGR ones were scrapped as early as 1915-17. The Manx examples still had bodies that were straight and square when they were scrapped in 1975/6, whereas the early bogies tended to be somewhat banana shaped with the truss roads screwed so far down that they were nearly through the headstocks!

Peter in AZ

River Lin · Post by **River Lin** » Thu Nov 19, 2015 9:24 pm

It is said that the Gloucester Wagon Co. who built the NWNG Cleminsons also built garden sheds. Looking at the quality of some garden sheds one comes across may explain why they were scrapped so soon.
On a more serious note, Google throws up many examples of how other modellers have approached the under carriage problem. I am sure I will come up with something that will work OK.

River Lin · Post by **River Lin** » Tue Mar 22, 2016 7:03 pm

Hi all.
It's taken a while but have finally got the sides and ends completed, primed and one coat of maroon top coat. I originally tried to apply a dark varnish but despite trying to be careful when gluing all of the small parts together and sanding as much as I dare I could not get rid of glue smears on the wood. This left a very patchy and unacceptable blotchy finish with the dark varnish. During my research I found that the 12 inches to the foot version was quickly changed from varnished wood to maroon paint so I feel justified.
The 5th item in the set is the internal divider to provide two compartments which will have bench seating around the sides of each compartment.
I have also been building new bogies under the floor to lower the coach and have managed to lose about 5mm which should be about right. More pics to follow as work progresses.

Note that because this is a new build I have been able to provide provision for slaters chopper couplings namely an 8mmx3mm slot rather than try to cut it later David

Post by **Andrew** » Tue Mar 22, 2016 7:26 pm

Looking good! I think it'll be nicer in maroon, less shed-like than varnish I reckon. Not that I've got anything against varnished carriages, I just reckon paint will suit this one better...

Looking forward so seeing it take shape - I always like the bit where 2D becomes 3D...

Cheers,

Andrew

Soar Valley Light · Post by **Soar Valley Light** » Tue Mar 22, 2016 10:13 pm

I agree with Andrews comments. It's a lovely looking piece of work and the livery definitely suits it - or is that my Midland roots showing through?

River Lin · Post by **River Lin** » Thu Mar 24, 2016 12:01 pm

So 2D becomes 3D

Now to complete work on the modified underframe and paint and fit the doors and droplights. Then it's on to the roof and fitting out the inside.

River Lin · Post by **River Lin** » Fri Mar 25, 2016 8:10 pm

Now the coach has its boots on I can adjust the coupling hight with shims above the bogies.

Central partition fitted with one door temporarily in place to test fit now the door frames are painted. I think I may have to shave the door edges a little.

View of the new bogies showing the wheels now raised into the bogie top plate to lower the coach and therefore the coupling height.
The next job is to trim all the edges on the doors to allow for paint thickness.

Garden Railway Forum

NWNG Cleminson

NWNG Cleminson

Who is online