(WH)WHR Rolling Stock

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Andrew
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Re: (WH)WHR Rolling Stock

Post by Andrew » Sun Dec 26, 2021 1:32 pm

Hi all,

I finished the Coopercraft Croesor slate wagons just before Christmas, haven't given them a test run yet, but I did take them outside for a quick photograph.

Here's a "Before" picture:

Croesoe before.jpg
Croesoe before.jpg (198.01 KiB) Viewed 3138 times

And here they are "after":

Croesor after 1.jpg
Croesor after 1.jpg (191.18 KiB) Viewed 3138 times
Croesor after 2.jpg
Croesor after 2.jpg (205.93 KiB) Viewed 3138 times

All good rusty fun - I was pleased with how the rather rustic brake gear turned out on the black one. The lettering is in the style of the "Parc & Croesor" wording on the originals but represents the fictional Clarach Quarry instead.

Cheers all,

Andrew.

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Re: (WH)WHR Rolling Stock

Post by Peter Butler » Sun Dec 26, 2021 2:54 pm

Now those are impressive... superb weathering.
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Re: (WH)WHR Rolling Stock

Post by Andrew » Thu Jan 13, 2022 11:32 am

Hello!

I find myself unexpectedly working from home today, so took advantage of that by seizing the opportunity to take a quick snap of my latest project.

It's intended to become a Welsh Highland slate wagon - that's the conventional "crate" type, the WHR also used simple open wagons for slate traffic. There were a number of different designs, but only one (unusual) type has been drawn, and few photos exist. Mine will be a composite design based on those photos, with typical WHR features, most notably an iron body on a wooden chassis, and a lack of bracing on the corners - I'll dig out a photo at some point.

My idea is to build this around a cheap flat wagon kit, for speed and reliable running, and because in the absence of drawings no-one can tell me it's wrong! I opted for the Phil Sharples kit, and so far I've opened up the slots for the solebars to accommodate larger wheels, cut down the bufferbeams to made curved buffer/couplings, and hacked the original dummy solebars around and glued them on to thicken the frame. I've also stained the deck and coated everything in MDF sealer. Here's what it looks like so far:

WHR slate wagon 1.jpg
WHR slate wagon 1.jpg (267.46 KiB) Viewed 3049 times

If the whole project works I plan to build another 4 or 5 of these, so I might see if it's possible (and cost-effective) for Phil to cut the parts to incorporate the modifications I've made, and to supply them with larger wheels - he's happily done the latter for me before.

The next step will be to tidy up the chassis and add dummy axleguards, then I'll need to tackle the ironwork, which is where the whole thing might fall apart, literally.

In other exciting wagon news, the number plates for my FR van turned up - naturally they were sitting in a drawer I'd already checked three times, but I didn't spot them until I went looking for something else. I might weather them a little to match the rest of the van, but I'm very pleased with how they finish the whole thing off, thanks Philip!

Van 101 complete.jpg
Van 101 complete.jpg (105.32 KiB) Viewed 3049 times

Cheers all,

Andrew.

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Re: (WH)WHR Rolling Stock

Post by philipy » Thu Jan 13, 2022 1:15 pm

That van looks a treat Andrew. You ought to tone the plates down a bit to match the rest of the ironwork though. :)
Philip

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Re: (WH)WHR Rolling Stock

Post by Andrew » Sun Jan 16, 2022 1:43 pm

Afternoon all!

A little progress to report on the prototype WHR slate wagon, which has now reached the stage of looking like rather a smart little flat wagon:

WHR slate wagon 2.jpg
WHR slate wagon 2.jpg (178.9 KiB) Viewed 2993 times

I took it for a test run up the line this morning, and all seems well - the weight under the floor no doubt helps. These small, light, wagons are always a little track-shy, but it seemed perfectly happy being pushed through the points etc.

WHR slate wagon 3.jpg
WHR slate wagon 3.jpg (254.59 KiB) Viewed 2993 times

I'll head off to the model shop one day this week to purchase some plastic strip for the body, but first I'll need to measure up and maybe make some drawings to determine exactly what I'll need.

Cheers,

Andrew

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Re: (WH)WHR Rolling Stock

Post by philipy » Sun Jan 16, 2022 1:54 pm

Andrew, I just scrolled back up the page and realised that somehow I missed weathering on the rusty Croesor wagons. That is superb, absolutely believable rusty metal, no way are they plastic! :lol:
Philip

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Re: (WH)WHR Rolling Stock

Post by ge_rik » Sun Jan 16, 2022 4:25 pm

philipy wrote: Sun Jan 16, 2022 1:54 pm Andrew, I just scrolled back up the page and realised that somehow I missed weathering on the rusty Croesor wagons. That is superb, absolutely believable rusty metal, no way are they plastic! :lol:
Me too! How did you achieve the crumbly rust effect? Is it iron filings or some other secret ingredient?

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Re: (WH)WHR Rolling Stock

Post by Andrew » Sun Jan 16, 2022 8:45 pm

Glad you like the rust effect.

Yes, it's iron filings, applied while the paint was wet then "activated" with copper sulphate solution, which appears to create a far more orange rust than using vinegar. I think I could probably vary the colour by changing the strength of the solution - some experimenting is required... The darker rust inside of the wagons is just diluted black paint sloshed over the top, to represent coal dust - it seeped through some holes I'd made in the side of the grey wagon (to represent more extreme corrosion), which wasn't really what I'd planned, but it does serve to vary the colour of the rust.

I think the best effect I've managed is where I've painted over the edges of the patches of filings before applying the copper sulphate - the rust then appears underneath the paint, looking like it's taking hold of the next bit of the iron. The streaks and other surface rust are just dilute acrylic paint brushed on - the overall effect is better than if you look too closely, I think!

Incidentally, I discovered after I started using it that copper sulphate is pretty nasty stuff and should be handled and disposed of with care - there was no warning on the packet, or on the website I purchased it from, so I assumed it was fairly harmless. Luckily, I seem to have survived...

Cheers,

Andrew

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Re: (WH)WHR Rolling Stock

Post by Lonsdaler » Mon Jan 17, 2022 12:11 pm

As a child, I remember having chemistry sets full of all sorts of now difficult to get chemicals - Copper Sulfate was one of the more interesting, especially when growing a chemical garden😱
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Re: (WH)WHR Rolling Stock

Post by Andrew » Sat Feb 05, 2022 4:51 pm

Afternoon all,

I'm hoping to get the WHR slate wagon finished this weekend. Here's where it was up to last night, with (plastic strip) sides and ends assembled, and the (primarily Lego) axleguards awaiting painting. The upper part of the bodywork needs a coat of black too - I did the lower bits because they'd be fiddly later, but left the rest because I knew there's be filling and sanding to do .

WHR slate wagon 4.jpg
WHR slate wagon 4.jpg (118.43 KiB) Viewed 2661 times

It's actually progressed a little more since then, with painting complete and axleguards affixed - just weathering to go now...

Cheers,

Andrew.

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Re: (WH)WHR Rolling Stock

Post by Andrew » Sun Feb 06, 2022 1:33 pm

And the finished product:

WHR slate wagon 5.jpg
WHR slate wagon 5.jpg (187.38 KiB) Viewed 2621 times

And again, in company of some other wagons:

WHR slate wagon 6.jpg
WHR slate wagon 6.jpg (274.13 KiB) Viewed 2621 times

In the absence of drawings, and with only a a few photos to go on, I honestly don't know how accurate a model of a NWNGR/WHR "crate" wagon it is, but it recreates the most distinctive features of them, and captures the overall feel, I think. And, because I did things properly for once, and made myself a jig, it should be relatively simple to build some more. I think I'll make some variations, including braked examples, ones with different axleguards, and a wooden-slatted one, but that's all for another day...

Cheers,

Andrew.

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Re: (WH)WHR Rolling Stock

Post by Peter Butler » Sun Feb 06, 2022 2:20 pm

I agree with you Andrew, capturing the overall feel is sufficient to identify the item, which I think you have achieved perfectly well. The finish sits well with your other stock too, so you have every right to feel proud.
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Re: (WH)WHR Rolling Stock

Post by philipy » Sun Feb 06, 2022 2:51 pm

That is brilliant in every way, Andrew. Well done.
Philip

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Re: (WH)WHR Rolling Stock

Post by ge_rik » Mon Feb 07, 2022 12:00 pm

Nice one!

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Re: (WH)WHR Rolling Stock

Post by Lonsdaler » Mon Feb 07, 2022 3:17 pm

That there Lego is fancy stuff compared to what was available in my days. Oh to be young enough to have children again... Well, maybe not. Looks to be a very atmospheric little waggon :thumbup:
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Re: (WH)WHR Rolling Stock

Post by Andrew » Mon Feb 07, 2022 4:00 pm

Lonsdaler wrote: Mon Feb 07, 2022 3:17 pm That there Lego is fancy stuff compared to what was available in my days.
Nothing too fancy - just two bricks (a single stud and a thin 2x1 with a single bobble in the middle) that were available when I got into Lego in the early 80s, plus some plasticard bits.

When I built the grey open in the second picture I used a single stud with a hole in and pressed a bearing into it to recreate the distinctive NWNGR/WHR axleguards, see 20 or so pages back in the thread. I liked how it looked, so repeated it when I needed to do it again, but this one was OK as a dummy, so I just used a plain brick.

Luckily, my son's 16 now, so he wasn't too put out that I pinched his Lego!

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Re: (WH)WHR Rolling Stock

Post by Andrew » Sun Mar 13, 2022 1:30 pm

Afternoon all,

There's no rapid progress to report but I have been plodding on with a couple more WHR slate wagons. One is a slightly modified Binnie kit, the other's a scratch build to represent a wagon of the all metal type that appear once in a makers photo but then take a backseat (at least as far as photographers are concerned) until one puts in an appearance (minus it's body) on the demolition trains that tore up the track in the 40s.

Here they are:
IMG_20220313_131522835.jpg
IMG_20220313_131522835.jpg (1.79 MiB) Viewed 2568 times
The white one looks more complete than it really is - the other side doesn't exist yet because I've run out of plastic strip, the dummy running gear is just propped in place (with a piece of sea glass that just happened to be handy...) and I've yet to start on the complicated-looking brake gear. On the plus side, I'm going to paint it all black, so that bit should be quick!

Cheers,

Andrew

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Re: (WH)WHR Rolling Stock

Post by Old Man Aaron » Wed Mar 16, 2022 3:30 am

Another interesting and unusual prototype, I never knew there were any all-metal slate wagons on the WHR. I'd image they were more expensive than their timber-framed counterparts, and therefore far less common? That was the way with sugar cane wagons down here, anyway.
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Re: (WH)WHR Rolling Stock

Post by Peter Butler » Wed Mar 16, 2022 10:33 am

It is a very smart wagon and beautifully made too, a fine addition to the fleet.
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Re: (WH)WHR Rolling Stock

Post by Andrew » Wed Mar 16, 2022 2:50 pm

Glad you like the work so far...

It seems that this type of wagon was unusual on the NWNGR/WHR - most wagons were either all wood, or had iron bodies on wooden chassis.

If anyone's interested there are articles on WHR slate wagons here: https://www.welshhighlandheritage.co.uk ... -No-72.pdf (for the "box" type) and here: https://www.welshhighlandheritage.co.uk ... -No-74.pdf (for the "crate" type).

Reading those will reveal that I'm creating an impression rather than making accurate models (the Binnie wagon should be wider, and the scratchbuilt one narrower, for example), but nonetheless I should end up with a rake that looks the part, with a rake of various types and in an assortment of sizes, with identifiably NWNGR characteristics and a family "look" to them...

Aaron, as I recall, the relative costs of metal and wooden wagons are discussed in the article - I think I've read somewhere (possibly in the attached articles) that the quarries preferred wooden wagons, because they were kinder to the slate, but the railways preferred metal ones, which required less maintenance.

I may make some more progress this evening - riveting, I think...

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