Garden Railway Forum

Hi guys,
During the steam age, did the UK ever make serious use of electric headlights (IE colonial or American style). Looking at backdating a Garratt and need an excuse to make it both British and have electric headlights.

JMORG wrote: Tue Dec 18, 2018 12:38 pm Hi guys,
During the steam age, did the UK ever make serious use of electric headlights (IE colonial or American style). Looking at backdating a Garratt and need an excuse to make it both British and have electric headlights.

Only the Lickey Banker had an electric headlight as far as I know and that was mounted at a pronounced downward angle for use when coupling up at night.

The LNER Garratt replaced the Lickey Banker in the '50s for a short while and was fitted with the headlight off the original 0-10-0. The headlight ended up on the 9F that finally replaced both of them.

Some late build LNER and Southern Pacifics had electric lighting, but that was just to provide the usual headcodes and didn't include a headlight.

Graeme

GTB wrote: Tue Dec 18, 2018 1:05 pm

JMORG wrote: Tue Dec 18, 2018 12:38 pm Hi guys,
During the steam age, did the UK ever make serious use of electric headlights (IE colonial or American style). Looking at backdating a Garratt and need an excuse to make it both British and have electric headlights.

Only the Lickey Banker had an electric headlight as far as I know and that was mounted at a pronounced downward angle for use when coupling up at night.

The LNER Garratt replaced the Lickey Banker in the '50s for a short while and was fitted with the headlight off the original 0-10-0. The headlight ended up on the 9F that finally replaced both of them.

Some late build LNER and Southern Pacifics had electric lighting, but that was just to provide the usual headcodes and didn't include a headlight.

Graeme

I mean, Technically there was a Narrow Gauge prototype. The Bowaters Paper Railway Fleet had Electric lights in the final few years of operation. Half of me is tempted to fit some headlights to one of my planned trio of Bagnall 0-6-2Ts..........

Jon

The Leek and Manifold locos had large headlights fitted, though they reputedly were never used.

GTB wrote: Tue Dec 18, 2018 1:05 pm
Only the Lickey Banker had an electric headlight as far as I know and that was mounted at a pronounced downward angle for use when coupling up at night.

Graeme

All the examples I've ever heard of have been mentioned. It wasn't common in this country where the railways were all fenced and could reasonably be expected to be clear of obstructions most of the time.

Out of interest. The Lickey bankers were never hooked on. It was one of the rare Sectional Appendix exemptions from doing so. Presumably this speeded things up by not stopping heavy trains at Blackewell to chop the banker off and having to restart again. With this method of working a train might sometimes pull away from a bank engine and I've always believed that the headlamp was to enable the bank engine Driver to be able to find the rear of the train again in the dark Worcestershire countryside without the risk of a 'heavy buffer up'.

Andrew

Thanks guys, I'll probably get some small single beam units for the Garratt. The Darjeeling locomotives used similar set-ups during the 1920's.

JMORG wrote: Sun Dec 23, 2018 9:30 am Thanks guys, I'll probably get some small single beam units for the Garratt. The Darjeeling locomotives used similar set-ups during the 1920's.

The small headlight and turbo alternator used on the Ceylon H1 Garratt look like Stones products and would be suitable. The preserved NGG11 in South Africa looks like it has something similar in some of the photos I've seen.


The Bowaters arrangement of a couple of motor bike headlights and a truck battery works and in the best bush engineering tradition was used on a few Aust and NZ timber trams. I assume Bowaters used a battery, as there is no visible evidence of a turbogenerator being fitted.

Regards,
Graeme

When fitting working headlights on models I always use a grain-of-wheat "proper" light bulb. These give a warm pink light that mimics those seen on the full-size Darj locos. LEDs can be a bit stark and bright.

TonyW wrote: Sun Dec 23, 2018 1:34 pm When fitting working headlights on models I always use a grain-of-wheat "proper" light bulb. These give a warm pink light that mimics those seen on the full-size Darj locos. LEDs can be a bit stark and bright.

Agree with Tony here, they look good on my Brandbright Cricket:

TonyW wrote: Sun Dec 23, 2018 1:34 pm When fitting working headlights on models I always use a grain-of-wheat "proper" light bulb. These give a warm pink light that mimics those seen on the full-size Darj locos. LEDs can be a bit stark and bright.

Tony, what LEDs have you tried?

White LEDs actually emit UV and like a fluoro tube, the colour temperature you get depends on the phosphor used. The 'standard' white ones emit a distinct blue white light, but there are white LEDs available that emit a warmer colour. Usually referred to as warm white, or golden white and the body is an orange colour rather than clear.

The warm white 3mm LEDs I fitted in the Ceylon Garratt have a definite yellow cast that is a good match to the headlights the VR used on mainline bg steam locos. These gave off a warm golden light, nothing like the blue white sealed beam lights you see on modern diesels.

On my railcars I used yellow LEDs to simulate the colour you'd expect from headlights running off a 6V automotive electrical system.

It was like trying to take a photo of a black rat in a coal mine, but the colour in the attached shot is what I get with the warm white LEDs fitted to my Garratt.


Regards,
Graeme

GTB wrote: Mon Dec 24, 2018 12:42 pmTony, what LEDs have you tried?

None recently, so thanks for the additional information. However, I do still have a big bundle of bulbs...!

Soar Valley Light wrote: Fri Dec 21, 2018 8:53 pm

All the examples I've ever heard of have been mentioned. It wasn't common in this country where the railways were all fenced and could reasonably be expected to be clear of obstructions most of the time.

To earn money for college and flight training, when I was a lad I worked on the Canadian Pacific Railway as a "brakeman" and "yard helper" which in British terms would be something like a guard's assistant when shunting or taking the redundant position of "fireman" in the cab of a locomotive on the main line. I don't know what this position is called in the motherland but on North American railways it's called "brakeman"... the next step had I stayed would have been "conductor".

Anyway, in this context, I find the prospect of hurtling down the rails at night without a headlight starkly terrifying!

Although, if I think about it for a while, at speed, the chances of being able to stop before hitting anything within the beam of the headlight would have been nil anyway. But I suppose it's of phychological comfort to anyone who is simply used to it.

As mentioned previously , using the correct type of LED is critical to having something that looks correct as a headlight. Also, you can easily paint the LED to gain the required effect too if needed. That biggest advantage with LEDs is the very low current draw, so battery’s last a hell of a lot longer than with traditional style globes of equivalent size. I recently fitted an interior light into a brake van kit I was building from Houston gate locomotive works , and in the process I accidentally got a fairly heavy but even coat of grey etch primer on the LED. I almost cleaned it off but had second thoughts about it, opting instead to test the lighting first because I was a little worried the LED would throw off too much light for such a small area and look very unrealistic. The result was petty much bang on what I wanted so the overspray stayed. I will attach a photo in the next post

Photo of the van being built , before painting, and the finished look at night time

That's a nice warm glow effect from the LED you have used, what is its specification?

I purchased them off a Chinese eBay seller that didn’t give much info on them other than they were 3mm , warm white, 9-12v operating range , and very cheap.