Garden Railway Forum

Really nice!

A query/request for info, please.

For a long time I've been puzzling over the couplings used by the F & B, but I now need to fit them and it has become fairly urgent.

The drawings in the Chris Jones book all show the loco with a shackle, two links and a hook, the hook being held up by a stirrup around the buffer shank - presumably to stop it dragging on the ground. The works photo supports this idea. So far so good.
However, the coach drawings show them all having a fixed hook at one end and a fixed loop at the other, but no sign of any links. There is one not very clear photo, which shows a coach behind an engine and a hook from the engine side hooked into a fixed loop on the coach. That makes sense except that the engine coupling would need to be about 38mm long o/a to stretch between the loco and coach, i.e. approx 2'6". Since the locos and coaches used similar buffers the same measurement applies between coaches as well.

However, if the coaches all had only a fixed loop and a fixed hook, how did they actually couple, was there a set of free chains with a hook at one end and a loop at the other? That doesn't sound very safe for passenger stock even by the standards of an impecunious narrow gauge line in the 3rd quarter of the 19th Century.

As far as I can tell, the Talyllyn used a similar system but with the addition of coupling links fixed to the hook by a shackle through the back of the hook.

Any thoughts anyone?

Can't help with your question Philip, but you raise an interesting point regarding the distance between coupled stock.
I've always thought that the Accucraft chopper couplings set stock too far apart to my eye. I guess being used to seeing
our narrow gauge stock with a smaller sized Knuckle coupling. That's why I mount my couplings behind and through the buffer
beam with a 4mm spacer.
Grant.

LNR wrote: Thu Jan 22, 2026 10:51 pm Can't help with your question Philip, but you raise an interesting point regarding the distance between coupled stock.

Grant,
I've now drawn it a bit more accurately, using dims for the various links etc that look feasible, and with a 2mm gap between buffer faces when the couplings are at at max extension I get a face to face distance between the vehicles of 39.8mm ( that's theoretical of course!) i.e 2'6"

That sounds good Philip.
Don't get me wrong I wasn't saying a long distance was bad, just strange to my eyes. Somewhere I thought I had a pic. of two new welded chopper couplings that the Ffestiniog were experimenting with and I remember they seemed very long. Some of the old black and white movies of UK narrow gauge seem to show long couplings almost sagging down with a little wear, and of course on locos they generally don't have room for the drag box to be behind the drag beams.
Grant.

No I didn't think you were being critical, don't worry.

Anyway, unless somebody pops up to clarify things, I've decided that the drawings in the book must have an error and the 'hook end' of the coaches must in fact be a "hook on a chain" and this is how it looks: After searching around I've sourced some 10mm brass shackles from Cornwall Model Boats, I've printed some hooks which look as though they might be strong enough ( fingers crossed!) and a couple of chain links should be no prob, so hopefully thats got it sorted.

philipy wrote: Fri Jan 23, 2026 8:37 am I've decided that the drawings in the book must have an error and the 'hook end' of the coaches must in fact be a "hook on a chain".

Now that I can visualise it, it looks like a longer version of the 'hook and ring coupler' used by QLD cane trams in the steam era. Not the highest tech coupler around even that far back.

https://www.zelmeroz.com/mrqc/notes2/mo ... odcane.pdf

Graeme

philipy wrote: Fri Jan 23, 2026 8:37 am No I didn't think you were being critical, don't worry.

Anyway, unless somebody pops up to clarify things, I've decided that the drawings in the book must have an error and the 'hook end' of the coaches must in fact be a "hook on a chain" and this is how it looks:Screenshot.jpg

After searching around I've sourced some 10mm brass shackles from Cornwall Model Boats, I've printed some hooks which look as though they might be strong enough ( fingers crossed!) and a couple of chain links should be no prob, so hopefully thats got it sorted.

Hi Philip, I have a similar setup for coupling on my GVT stock. One thing I found is I needed a bit more slack in the coupling to actually allow the hook to be connected to the corresponding shackle when coupling up stock. Looking at your drawing, you may have the same issue with only 2mm between buffers, that might not be enough to give enough movement in the hook to get it over the adjacent shackle, particularly if the buffers are solid and not sprung. I ended up using an eye bolt (Cornwall Model Boats sell Caldercraft eyebolts) to mount the coupling which then allows the actual position to be adjusted so that the coupling is functional.

Thanks. I had the tightness in mind anyway, but once I have all the bits and some real dimensions, I'll incorporate some slack as required.

I was beginning to think today would never come ... but...
SHE'S FINISHED!

Still just a shelf queen until the weather allows me to get near the track, but she does run.

You have done an excellent job. You must be well chuffed with the finish.

Chris

WOW!! just WOW!!! Gorgeous. You have certainly raised the bar with this one.

Very nice, great job Philip.

That is one very attractive and superbly modelled loco Philip, and well worth the time put into it. You should be well pleased.
Grant.
PS, ten out of ten for the rivet size and spacing too.

Thanks everyone, much appreciated.

An absolute beauty! Faultless!

Rik

Are the spectacle rings printed or brass castings?

Rik

ge_rik wrote: Thu Feb 05, 2026 7:43 am Are the spectacle rings printed or brass castings?

Rik

Thanks Rik.

Printed.
The outer ones are printed as part of the cab front, then there is a recess in the cab front behind it to take the glazing, and then the inside frames are separate and push into the recess and held with a few spots of canopy glue.
Hope that makes sense?

Very smart!
Love the colour too - am I correct in thinking that it is the Hycote red oxide primer + varnish?

StuartJ wrote: Thu Feb 05, 2026 10:21 am Very smart!
Love the colour too - am I correct in thinking that it is the Hycote red oxide primer + varnish?

Thanks Stuart. Yes, the Hycote red primer and two coats of Army Painter satin varnish on the body, and one coat of Army Painter matt varnish on the smokebox.