Rolling Stock for the Far End Tramway

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IrishPeter
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Re: Rolling Stock for the Far End Tramway

Post by IrishPeter » Tue Jan 01, 2019 4:41 am

I decided to have a go at building a bogie covered wagon out of Bristol board. The ancestry is vaguely Victoria Narrow Gauge, but that is more in terms of dimensions than anything else.
Peter2.JPG
Roof
By the time I thought to take any photographs I had got to the laminating the roof stage. The body of the wagon consists of three layers of Bristol board laminated together with wooden corner posts, and further supports at the one-third, and two thirds points along the body of the wagon. There are four wooden roof stretchers corresponding to the wooden stiffeners in the wagon body.
Peter4.JPG
Ready for paint
OK, let's stick it on some bogies and see how it looks before painting it... The roof is not stuck down yet as it has to be painted grey whilst the basic colour for the body is red oxide.
Peter10.JPG
Painted - details next
As in this... dummy door hardware and handrails will be fabricated out of various bits of card and wire, painted black, and glued on. It also needs lettering - at least the tare, the load, and running number, even if I am a bit agnostic about the owner for the time being. The picture also shows the difference in size between 15mm scale - the brake van - and Ga. 3/LGB/1:22.5 scale.
Peter7.JPG
MER Van
A chance remark earlier in the thread reminded me that I needed to repair the ducket on this Hurst Nelson MER brake van which has somehow managed to get itself transported to the Skebawn and Castleknox Railway.
Peter5.JPG
Shelter
The little Norwegian style platform shelter - halts - for the use of, - has had its roof finished, but still needs a few finishing touches.
Peter1.JPG
The Saxon Coach
The Saxon Coach is a bit of an orphan project at the moment as I built it to 16mm forgetting that I intend the Coverdale Light Railway to be 32mm gauge/1:22.5 scale to represent 2'6" gauge. It may end up allocated to S&CLR&T and running on 45mm bogies. I shall have to produce another in 17/32nds scale.
Peter9.JPG
Brake Van
And I am still trying to get a decent picture of the sentry box van with its red and barn red livery. I think it will get clobbered with the red oxide before long as that is closer to the original NER colours. Looks like Ole has been on the sauce...
Peter6.JPG
NQD
Oh, and the Newqidas are back in the mix for conversion into "3n2.5" rolling stock for the Coverdale Light Railway.

Cheers for now!
Peter in Va
Traffic Pattern? What pattern? Spuds out; grain in, but cattle, sheep and passengers are a lot less predictable.

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Re: Rolling Stock for the Far End Tramway

Post by LNR » Tue Jan 01, 2019 8:49 am

I can definitely see the Victorian origins in the bogie covered van Peter, don't know how
you keep track of the various scales you are using.
Grant.

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Re: Rolling Stock for the Far End Tramway

Post by ge_rik » Tue Jan 01, 2019 9:43 am

IrishPeter wrote:
Mon Dec 31, 2018 7:58 pm
p.s. Good news and bad news. The wife must be feeling better - I got busted for spray painting in the basement today! :lol:

Peter in Va
A few weeks ago, I'd been spray painting in the conservatory while my wife was out. A fussy neighbour came to the front door with a message for my wife. Her house is always immaculately clean, ours isn't. She sniffed the air and said, "Oh, been polishing the furniture?" Not only did I get away with it, I think I actually went up in her estimation.

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Re: Rolling Stock for the Far End Tramway

Post by IrishPeter » Tue Jan 01, 2019 2:50 pm

LNR wrote:
Tue Jan 01, 2019 8:49 am
I can definitely see the Victorian origins in the bogie covered van Peter, don't know how
you keep track of the various scales you are using.
Grant.
It isn't that bad - honest, Graeme! I have only made one clanger in 10 years, and that was with the Saxon coach, but it is recyclable onto the other line.

The Skebawn and Castleknox is 15mm scale/45mm gauge, which they seem to call Fn3 in the USA when they are not giving us brain cramps by calling it G. This works perfectly for a fictitious Irish line, so I have stuck with it, especially as 'Fn3' has decent support in the USA.

The CLR is 13.5mm scale and 32mm gauge, which is the same scale as Gauge 3 and LGB, also has the advantage of a respectable level of industry support in the USA. I suppose in NMRA over here would want to call it 3n30 - which looks too much like a "green diesel" era head code to me. My other interest beside Irish 3' is the sort of 2'6" gauge railways advocated around 1900 by E.R. Calthrop, and others. Ga.3 scale works for 2'6" gauge in that Ga. O scales out at about 2'4.5" which is a lot close to the correct gauge/scale relationship than either SM32 or SM45, though I did give 18mm:foot on 45mm gauge track some thought, but decided it was too big for the space available.

I just hope I do not get distracted by Norwegian 3'6" gauge again. That would be a straight forward LGB - 13.5mm scale/45mm gauge job.... ;) though 1:24 would be more accurate.

One thing that has to be considered is that I do tend to over think things!

Cheers,
Peter in Va
Traffic Pattern? What pattern? Spuds out; grain in, but cattle, sheep and passengers are a lot less predictable.

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Re: Rolling Stock for the Far End Tramway

Post by IrishPeter » Sat Jan 19, 2019 5:19 am

I have made a start on my first 'Ga.3n2.5' passenger vehicle using Bristol Board, though I did build a couple in 5.5mm scale 30 years ago using the directions in a book on model railways that "came out of the ark with Noah." The smaller scale stock was three laminations, but it looks like I will be doing at least four laminations this time, possibly five.

1. The outer skin.
2. Drop light frames.
3. Glazing
(4. Spacer)
5. The inner skin.

This should produce fairly rigid sides and ends. I am thinking the spacer layer will be unnecessary given the stiffness the glazing will impart, but I am still chewing on that fine point of design. However, the various layers will need to be painted before lamination, which means I am on the look out for a warm day - or a sustained absence of SWMBO from the house. ;) The colours will be maroon, light brown, nothing, and cream, or cream/light brown to reflect the sort of interior 1920s vehicles often had.

After that should come the partitions dividing the carriage into two vestibules, two lavatory compartments, and four passenger compartments. This coach is not symmetrical as the 3rd class half is about a foot shorter than the 1st class. This has driven me quietly nuts at the drawing out stage I basically drew one side upside down in order to get the doors and windows in the right place as that proved to be the easiest to do. I just hope I kept the paper with the dimensions noted on it in case I need to do another composite.

Pics in a day or two.

Cheers,
Peter in Va
Traffic Pattern? What pattern? Spuds out; grain in, but cattle, sheep and passengers are a lot less predictable.

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Photo Update - 23/1/19

Post by IrishPeter » Wed Jan 23, 2019 11:18 pm

Since the last time I had the camera out, I have managed to get an open wagon body made.
201901C.JPG
Wooden bogie open
This one is based on the early SAR narrow gauge opens. Needs strapping, but I tend to wait until I have three or four wagons that need doing then make myself miserable for an afternoon. It runs sprung and compensated O gauge trucks, same as the closed. They need bigger wheels - the original are a shade under 17mm, or about 16" in 1:22.6 scale, so I have some 20mm wheels on order, but the trucks may be too small, and in that case I will replacement with something with a longer wheelbase.
201901A.JPG
Goods stock
Here it is with the bogie van. They also need couplers. Like all colonial railways, the order for parts has duly been sent to Blighty.

The coach I am working on at the moment is based on a Kalka-Simla vehicle that was operating in the 1940s or 1950s - i.e. the generation of small window stock before the one they are currently rebuilding. Looking at various photographs, I would not be in the least surprised to discover that the present bogie carriages are riding on 1920s Leeds Forge underframes that are on their third or four body. I tweaked the design a little bit so that the two lavatory compartments were identical, and the end compartments are both six scale feet. The middle partition is a little off-centre to give the first class punters their accustomed extra space.
201901D.JPG
The puzzle
Here is one side of the carriage jigsaw puzzle with the outer, drop light, and inner layers clamped together just to make sure the alignment is correct - or at least close enough.
201901F.JPG
Lamination...
Here are the three layers laid out next to one another. I had not cut the windows on the inner yet. The light is indifferent in the basement.
201901H.JPG
Floor Plan
The floor plan of the vehicle ready for making all those blessed partitions. It is also a useful reminder that the vehicle is not quite symmetrical. It is a lavatory composite to seat 11 first, and 15 second class passengers. The seats will be long ways in the end compartments, and normal in the middle. It is a semi corridor vehicle.

That's it for now!

2-1

Peter in Va
Traffic Pattern? What pattern? Spuds out; grain in, but cattle, sheep and passengers are a lot less predictable.

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Re: Rolling Stock for the Far End Tramway

Post by FWLR » Thu Jan 24, 2019 8:15 am

Your rolling stock are getting more and more Peter. Soon be running has a train hey... :thumbright:
Rod

Life is so easy when I run my trains. :thumbright:

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https://gardenrails.org/forum/viewtopic ... 41&t=11364

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Re: Rolling Stock for the Far End Tramway

Post by IrishPeter » Mon Jan 28, 2019 5:33 am

I need to get out and survey the route up the garden. Our backyard is definitely 'Hill Railway' territory, but it would help me enormously to know if what I am looking at is more Kalka Simla - which is what I would prefer - or Darjeeling and Himalayan. That would settle me down as to scale, and what I am trying to achieve with the Far End Tramway. At the moment I am sort of tinkering about and seeing if the old skills are still there, but I need to get on and make some sort of solid progress. I am sort of amusing myself right now, and not getting anything decided.

The bleeping weather is not helping as it is alternating between cold and fine, and wet and warm. With the wind chill it is -9.5C/15F out there right now, and it is supposed to stay below freezing until the weekend. The other night the wind chills got the real feel down below -20C, which is a lot warmer than the Midwest, but bally cold for Virginia. So long as it stays this cold there is nothing much doing on the outdoor side. We are supposed to have a couple of warm, and DRY days Monday and Tuesday, so I will at least get some wagons spray painted then, and maybe start the survey of the back yard.

Cheers,
Peter in Virginia
Traffic Pattern? What pattern? Spuds out; grain in, but cattle, sheep and passengers are a lot less predictable.

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"Iron" Wagons

Post by IrishPeter » Tue Feb 05, 2019 2:00 am

I had forgotten how much I like Bristol board as a material. It is not everyone's choice, but I got used to it as a skint teenager, and given that even now I have to do my modelling on a shoe-string, it come in very useful from time to time. I have also decided I do not like messing around with 13.5mm to the foot, and have reverted to 16mm, or rather 5/8th" because metric and I don't get along. Very much a case of -

"Rule Britannia!
Two tanners make a bob,
Three make one and six,
and four two bob!"

I'm afraid. Also I can slide between eights, sixteenths, thirty seconds, and sixty fourths for a lot of the measurements. That way I can do most of the maths in my head, and use my favourite very unmetric 18" ruler to do the measuring

Anyway, here are the preliminary results. The first wagon is by Darj out of Kalka-Simla, and is an iron bodied van. Everything except the door bolt, buffers, and running gear is Bristol board.
Trains monday4.JPG
Iron Covered
It might get a wiggly tin roof if I can make a decent job of it, but I would want to experiment on something else, and master skills like not cutting myself before there was a major adventure with chopping up bean tins. I also need to give dummy brake gear some thought, or at least a brake handle to give every one the impression, etc., etc.. I have also just realised looking at the photo that I forgot the bally door hinges. :oops:

My conclusion on finishing that wagon was 'that didn't work out too bad' so I decided to have a go at an open wagon, which is a slightly bigger version - 12' against 10' - of a Darj prototype. Apart from not getting one of the angle supports quite vertical, it looks OK. I guess they were unloaded the hard way, as I could not find a door on any of them. I might do a variant with a centre "cupboard" doors before long, as that would make rolling things like scale 50 gallon drums of diesel out of the wagons easier.
Trains monday3.JPG
Iron Flat
And the two of them together look like this.
Trains monday2.JPG
Iron wagons
So how does my little train of 5/8th scale stock look? Well, like this -
Trains monday.JPG
Mtn Rly Train
It is all basic draw it out accurately, then use a steel straight edge, and a sharp knife type modelling. The running gear and couplings are from Binnie Engineering, the ever useful local hardware store provided paint and brass rod, and the lead weights to help give them a little heft came from a gas, beer, bait, and ammo store (one stop shopping for geezers) in the middle of nothing much where we - herself and me - stopped at for a tank of gas and a coke one day. One nice thing about card angle iron is that it tended to adopt the slightly wiggly appearance of hard use naturally, thus saving me a lot of bother.

I think I need to do a few more of each type now, so that the Far End Tramway has a decent amount of goods stock at the start. I am rather enjoying my little break from larger vehicles.

Cheers,
Peter in Va
Traffic Pattern? What pattern? Spuds out; grain in, but cattle, sheep and passengers are a lot less predictable.

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Re: Rolling Stock for the Far End Tramway

Post by Peter Butler » Tue Feb 05, 2019 10:35 am

Simple but effective Peter, un-fussy construction method works well and looks the part.
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Re: Rolling Stock for the Far End Tramway

Post by FWLR » Wed Feb 06, 2019 9:02 am

Agree, they do just look the part. They are brilliant and very well built. :thumbright:
Rod

Life is so easy when I run my trains. :thumbright:

🚂🚃🚃🚃🚃🚃🚃🚃🚃🚃

https://gardenrails.org/forum/viewtopic ... 41&t=11364

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Re: Rolling Stock for the Far End Tramway

Post by IrishPeter » Fri Feb 08, 2019 4:16 am

Added door hinges :oops: and handbrake levers today in among hands. Apart from some dabs of white or yellow paint on the ends of the brake levers, and a some lettering - basically tare, load, and owner - they are now complete. On to the next wagon or carriage. Pics when I next do a photo round up.

Peter in VA
Traffic Pattern? What pattern? Spuds out; grain in, but cattle, sheep and passengers are a lot less predictable.

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Re: Rolling Stock for the Far End Tramway

Post by ge_rik » Fri Feb 08, 2019 1:49 pm

Interesting question re the Shimla v Darjeeling. Both present some fascinating possibilities. You'd probably find the Darjeeling zig zags frustrating from an operational viewpoint, though interesting to construct. Spirals on the other hand would be great fun in all respects. The most significant feature of the KSR is the number of bridges (800) and tunnels (103) and it's a lot better engineered than the DHR, which basically just followed the old bullock cart road (hence the zig zags and spirals). Mind you, having a road adjacent to the railway for most of its length makes it very scenic, especially when they both pass through the towns and villages clinging to the mountainsides.

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Re: Rolling Stock for the Far End Tramway

Post by IrishPeter » Sat Feb 09, 2019 2:13 pm

I seem to think the DHR was built without zig-zags, Rik, but I would not want the pre-zig-zag grade! They were introduced 1881-1883 to reduce it - from 1 in 19 to 1 in 28! I am going to try to avoid anything that extreme on my line as they would, as you rightly point out, but bloody awkward to operate. What will probably emerge is something between the two - the Darj's lack of heavy engineering and spirals, but with the KSR's 1 in 33 ruling gradient. There will have to be the obligatory tunnel so I can get with mower over the line without lifting it over the rails, and possibly a 'gallery' on the raised section close to the house if the missus will tolerate it - if not it will have to be a girder bridge. She has already warned me that she does not mind looking out at a railway (if I make it 'tidy') but she does not want to have to look at Toytown! Message received and understood.

There's another van on the way, which is not quite so tall as the previous one. I needed something to divert me from the pile of meeting preparation I have to get through this week, including giving a lecture on the Evangelical Movement in the Protestant Episcopal Church! :study: At least the lecture bit will be fun.

Cheers,
Peter in Va
Traffic Pattern? What pattern? Spuds out; grain in, but cattle, sheep and passengers are a lot less predictable.

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Re: Rolling Stock for the Far End Tramway

Post by ge_rik » Sun Feb 10, 2019 9:11 am

IrishPeter wrote:
Sat Feb 09, 2019 2:13 pm
I seem to think the DHR was built without zig-zags, Rik, but I would not want the pre-zig-zag grade! They were introduced 1881-1883 to reduce it - from 1 in 19 to 1 in 28! I am going to try to avoid anything that extreme on my line as they would, as you rightly point out, but bloody awkward to operate. What will probably emerge is something between the two - the Darj's lack of heavy engineering and spirals, but with the KSR's 1 in 33 ruling gradient. There will have to be the obligatory tunnel so I can get with mower over the line without lifting it over the rails, and possibly a 'gallery' on the raised section close to the house if the missus will tolerate it - if not it will have to be a girder bridge. She has already warned me that she does not mind looking out at a railway (if I make it 'tidy') but she does not want to have to look at Toytown! Message received and understood.

There's another van on the way, which is not quite so tall as the previous one. I needed something to divert me from the pile of meeting preparation I have to get through this week, including giving a lecture on the Evangelical Movement in the Protestant Episcopal Church! :study: At least the lecture bit will be fun.

Cheers,
Peter in Va
I hadn't realised the zig zags were a later addition, but it makes sense. Certainly a low tech way of gaining extra height without major realignment.

What I found fascinating about the building of the KSR were the stories of a local workman (Baba Bhalku) they employed who proved to be a intuitive surveyor. Not only did he instinctively know the best route to take, he was able to align the two ends of the line's longest tunnel by tapping on the walls with his staff to decide where they needed to dig. Previously, the tunnel's original engineer had committed suicide with shame because his predicted path for two ends of the tunnel missed their targets. Apparently, Bhalku was somewhat eccentric, for example feeding the lice in his matted hair and beard a daily diet of honey and flour. Not that I'm suggesting you need to follow suit to accurately survey the route for your line :shock:

Rik
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