Coal baskets; what were they for?

[Boustrophedon]

Coal baskets; what were they for? Please don't say for putting coal in, I know that.

OK so they have coal in, then what? How do you use the coal that's in them, particularly the ones on top of the water tank, how was the fireman to get to them to fire the engine?

How was a small tank loco coaled, without a tender?

[invicta280]

I was thinking about that a few days ago while contemplating my Owain/Ragleth. That has removable coal baskets on the tanks, one of which covers the gas filler point.
As we all know, on the DHR they have blokes sitting up on the boiler passing buckets of coal down to the fireman ( as well as people on the front buffer beam sanding the track) but I can't think that they would get away with that on UK/ European lines.

[artfull dodger]

The videos from the footplate that i have watched, those coal baskets actualy extended down into the water tanks on the real locomotives. They had a opening at the bottom to spill that coal onto the footplate for the fireman to shovel or throw into the firebox. I have seen it thrown by hand and with a shovel/scoop. The opening at the top looked like a basket, but I think its mostly to keep the coal from going places it shouldn't. I have seen the coal "baskets" refilled with anything from buckets, actual weaved baskets to wheelbarrows rolled up a gang plank laid on the side of the side tank. Its whatever worked for that particular railway. Mike

[Boustrophedon]

Ah! that makes sense, many thanks.

[AFGadd]

Locos carry "coal bunkers" in which coal is stored.
Depending on the railway the loco works will depend on the size of the bunker.
Bunkers can be in the cab, Quarry Hunslets are a good example of this. Some carry the bunker at the rear, ISSAC on the L&BR is a good example of this.
Some locos have a bunker "let" into the water tank, this is seen perfectly in the Ffestiniog Fairlies.
In some instances a "cage" or basket arrangement around the top of the bunker will give a greater coal capacity.
The Fairlie has an arrangement of boards that allow the coal to be stacked up against the boiler...

[steam4ian]

Coal baskets were made of wicker and contained about a bushel; about the same size as a washing basket.

They were used for hand coaling locos where there was no mechanical or gravity means. Coal would be left either on the ground or on a platform (stage) adjacent the loco servicing road. The luckless fireman would shovel the coal to fill the baskets then lift the baskets up to the bunker. Some locations had a crude sort of crane for lifting the baskets particularly if the coal was on the ground.

When larger locos where being tested for efficiency or to assess performance they were frequently coaled using baskets as a means of measuring the amount of coal consumed during the test.

[stoker]

When larger locos where being tested for efficiency or to assess performance they were frequently coaled using baskets as a means of measuring the amount of coal consumed during the test.

So it was the fireman's fault if he failed to shovel enough coal?

[Big Jim]

Having a mate who was a BR top-link driver, I am given to understand it was always the firemans fault, or the signalman, or the platelayer, fitter, shed foreman, tea boy, workshop cat etc, etc. [/i]

[River Lin]

Hi all
This is myself and George Bishop coaling Linda at Port in August 1970 with Alan Garraway on the footplate of "his engine". We were spending the holiday as trainee firemen and this was one of the jobs we were rostered to do. On one day we emptied a BR main line coal waggon into Ffestiniog trucks in Minffordd yard in one day.



In this view of the Earl you can clearly see the sloping wooden boards to keep the coal off the boiler and guide it down the chute to the fireman.


These photos were taken during this summer holiday. On a day off we walked from Ddyallt to Blaenau Ffestiniog along the old track bed using a roll of film as we went. We went as far as the following photo opportunity but I regret ever since not carrying on behind me to the old original station at the foot of the Quarry incline near the centre of town. This is the site of the station over the road from BR.

[IrishPeter]

One trick on the Ballycastle Railway was to put a slack handful of baskets on the running plate in front of the smoke box so you could top off the coal bunker ready for the first run of the morning into Ballymoney. In theory, the S class 2-4-2Ts had enough capacity for the 32 mile round trip, but some crews took the better safe than sorry approach, and there was the amount of coal used for lighting up to consider.

On the IMR the old wicker baskets were left on the coaling stages at Douglas and elsewhere, and if you were lucky, someone with a few minutes to kill would have filled a few baskets and give you a head start on coaling. Usually the driver would fill the baskets - which is the cleaner job - and the fireman hump them up to bunker. It was also handy to be able to walk along a scaffold plank carry a bushel basket full of coal, as that was often the way back up to the footplate.

Peter in AZ