Thomas Telford Locomotive - Take Two

[Bill/Rubery]

I think your sumise about the cab of that Mamod is correct....it looks most strange! I think the engine with a higher weather board would pass as a 7/8" scale engine though personally I would not buy a ordinary Mamod as I want a locomotive to work properly straight out of the box...Like my old 'Millie'!

[mikewakefielduk@btinterne]

I think with Mamods its purely down to luck whether the one you purchase runs well straight from the box or not, no matter which model you buy. I've been very lucky with my Brunel and the only build quality issue I had was a wonky wheel. However others have had real problems getting them to run properly.

Don't get me wrong about the Telford, after fixing the quality control issues from when I first got it, it runs pretty well now, but unfortunately not on my railway with its gradient and tight curves. As this is something I experience with all my non-geared locos what I should be doing is fixing the track not the trains. However that's easier said than done as it would need serious negotiation with the Head Gardener. So instead I stick to locos with a 0-4-0 wheel arrangement and fit radio control or at least a 4:1 gear reduction.

Mike

[steamie1]

I suppose R/C is your only way out with this one. I have a friend who has a Mk2 his went really well out the box as mine did. What do you think of Mk2's in relation to these two (Brunel and now Telford)? Can you tell I'm thinking of another Mamod ltd product?

I dunno I should be content with the two locos I have. It is just the quick simplicity that's handy. I have just demonstrated my line to a stranger and it all took so much time. My Mk2 I could just brew a cup of tea pour some of the hot water into Mamod Mk2(soft water in Cornwall) oil it, light it and by the time my tea was cold enough to drink it was off. The non railway educated, mildly curious, customers were all happy. If I run a Roundhouse I'm just not as care free. If it hit something and bounced off I'd check where the scratch was and that's all. If a Roundhouse bounced off with lining that cost as much as a Mamod Mk2, I'd be upset. Mamods are simple fun.

Hey! guys has anyone else got theirs running too?

[steamie1]

Has anyone more running news with the Telford?

[mikewakefielduk@btinterne]

Not really.

There's this info on the Mamod web page: http://www.mamod.co.uk/category/mamod-n ... es/page/3/

You'll need to scroll down to the June 13th entry

There's also this: http://www.mamod.co.uk/mamod-news/produ ... ocomotive/

Which begins: "The Telford locomotive is a long-awaited model from the Mamod production line and anticipation is already growing for its release.

While it is still an ongoing project at the company's headquarters in Smethwick there has already been talk of a slide valve version being made. At the moment the oscillating version is still in the production phase and will not be released until all the problem areas have been ironed out to Mamod's full satisfaction. Once it is finally launched collectors will no doubt want to know how to fire up this impressive model."

So clearly they're still having some issues. Personally I've thrown in the towel as its clear I'm never going to be able to run it satisfactorily on my track and have limited myself to either geared locos or the simpler Accucraft models which can take a radio control on the reverser.

If they ever get a slide valve loco working and the regulator can be radio controlled I'll think again.

The only other way forward might be this "SloMo" flywheel attachment you may have read about (look at the Summerlands Chuffer website if you haven't). Its something I might experiment with myself this Autumn if I have time.

I understand Mamod are at the Llanfair Show at the end of the month, so if anybody is going perhaps they can ask? I normally attend but this year the dates are clashing with a family camping weekend.

Mike

[mikewakefielduk@btinterne]

You may have seen Doug Roberts posting on Facebook of the Thomas Telford on the Mamod stand at the Warley Show this weekend past. Having looked at the photos and read what Doug had written I spoke to David at Mamod for clarification.

He confirmed they'd got the new piston valve version of the Telford to run well. It will be released for sale in Spring 2015.

As you can see from Doug's photos, they've dropped the rectangular lubricator in favour of a cylindrical design. They're still deciding on the design of the roof as it will need to be removable to access the gas and oil fillers.

They will not be selling an oscillating version of the Telford but will be continuing with the Mk11.

A model of the loco will be sent to Tag Gorton at Garden Rail for evaluation.

and that's all I know.

Mike

[mikewakefielduk@btinterne]

To quote from the Mamod website: "So with production of the Diamond Jubilee complete, what is next from the Mamod production line? A simple answer – The Telford which is due to be launched in late February 2015."

[steamie1]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aLgMBNS ... ploademail

[mikewakefielduk@btinterne]

That's great to see, I had been hoping Peter would get a video out in plenty of time before the launch next year. I wonder why its not on their official website.

Although the video is quite fuzzy, looking carefully I think the tender has a single central buffer as well. Maybe they'll bring out other rolling stock.

Glad to see they've been listening to Chris about the 240 steam oil.

Will be interesting to see what cosmetic changes are made to the body, particularly the cab.

[Bill/Rubery]

EErrr...Mike, When you talk of 240 engine oil where is this oil coming from? I ask as the only oil I have ever used is the THICK steam oil one buys from Brandbright. I wonder if that oil has a number attached to it....by the way, ....Happy Christmas!

[mikewakefielduk@btinterne]

Hi Bill

240 oil is the thinner grade used by Roundhouse, so you can buy it directly from them (I did). Virtually all other makers of steam locos use the 460 grade oil.


Mike

[Chris Cairns]

It is actually 220 steam oil (Compound Bearing Oil) that Peter was referring to. This is used by Roundhouse following problems with 460 steam oil (Compound Steam Cylinder Oil) blocking the superheater pipes with carbonised oil.

Unfortunately there is no one brand or viscosity of steam oil that will work correctly with every live steam locomotive (or at least not in my collection).

Accucraft & Regner (plus the departed Cheddar Models) recommend 460 steam oil but it is the darker treacle colour oil that they sell as an optional extra (think this is the same colour as the Brandbright one). However the 460 steam oil supplied by Mamod, and Morris Lubricants which we use on our full size locomotive, is a lighter colour which my Cheddar/GRS Tram throws a wobbly with. Still not found out what the difference is between these same viscosity but different colour 460 steam oils.

Some time back on this Forum a few of use experimented with different viscosity steam oils in order to find a solution to the speed bursts that are unique to these Mamod locomotives. The conclusion was they occurred least with the Roundhouse 220 steam oil which is what I now use in my Mamod/MSS locomotives. I recently obtained a bottle of the treacle Cheddar Models 460 steam oil which I now use on the Cheddar/GRS Tram. I'm about to try it on my Accucraft Edrig to see if it improves its running, and my Lumber Jack was making some obvious signs during continuous running at a recent exhibition that it was not liking the Mamod 460 steam oil.

Worth pointing out that Accucraft & Regner do not provide steam oil with their locomotives - you have to buy it separately. Presumably an artificial method used to disguise price increases.

One of our 16mm Group member's uses 680 Steam Cylinder Steam oil in his mainly scratch built locos as he had access (free if I recall correctly) to a large supply, and has supplied it to other members.

Chris Cairns
(edited to remove incorrect Roundhouse reference)

[mikewakefielduk@btinterne]

Yes, 220 not 240. No idea why I keep getting it wrong but I usually do, just as I keep spelling "amount" as "ammount".

I have a bottle of Regner 460 steam oil (that came with my Lumber Jack kit) and that works fine with not only my Regners but also my Accucraft and Brunel. Confusingly the Mamod provided oil seems to work fine with everything except the Lumber Jack. No idea why, the only difference with the Lumber Jack is it has a deadleg lubricator a good few centimetres from the direct steam line.

Mike

[Palmerston]

My Roundhouse locomotives have all been deliverd with oil.

Have been using 220 exclusively for locomotives and stationairy engines, whatever brand, Roundhouse, Accucraft, Aster, Regner. MAMOD and Wilesco engines fitted with scratch build lubricators.

Find the 460 or even 680 to thick and makes i difficult to clean the locos. 220 wipes off easy. These small locos operate at low pressure and temperature steam, hence no need for thick oil!

My supplier: Roundhouse

[Chris Cairns]

My Roundhouse locomotives have all been delivered with oil.

My mistake. Yes Roundhouse do supply a bottle of steam oil with their locomotives. Above post corrected.

It has previously been discussed on this Forum that you need to use 460 steam oil with Accucraft's - http://gardenrails.myfreeforum.org/ftop ... 0-asc-.php

Yes, 220 not 240. No idea why I keep getting it wrong

It was because Peter said 240 in his video.

Your Lumber Jack is the same as mine then not liking Mamod 460 steam oil either. I get a lot of condensed steam coming off the cylinder backplates and it starts to run rough when it gets hot from continuous running using the Mamod 460 steam oil, yet there is plenty of steam oil covering the outside of the cylinders at the end of a run. I had a similar problem with my Cheddar/GRS Tram where enough steam was leaking from the cylinder back plates preventing it to run, with the solution being to change to the treacle coloured 460 steam oil instead.

Chris Cairns

[mikewakefielduk@btinterne]

I've just got my PC working again after a disk crash and discovering none of the backups this side of February 2012 were readable. Any emails received since then, including the detailed ones from Chris, have unfortunately been lost.

Anyway, am now back on line and have been reading the news section of the Mamod web site. Apparently its going to be the year of the Telford, so that's something to finally look out for. Mind you the same article also said the Telford was an updated version of the Diamond Jubilee saddle tank, which is not quite how I see it. Surely an updated William would be nearer the mark?

Mamod are going to be at both the Midlands garden Rail Show in mid March and the 16mmngm Show at the beginning of April, so presumably they'll have the Telford ready in time.

Mike

[dougrail]

THOMAS TELFORD LOCOMOTIVE UPDATE 15-01-15

1) Chimney



At Warley, looking at photos, the brass fitting was a conical/diamond shape downwardly pushed into the chimney. As seen here, this was artfully curved, made to be more flush with the actual stack and louvered on top for a more pleasing look.



2)Cab



Cab back has now been developed. The sliding roof has also been designed and built to prototype level. Think old-school Accucraft.



Inside the cab is a new shot of the new inline lubricator. The gas tank is made from brass and pressure tested [NOT plastic as many thought]. The regulator has been fine tuned to try and get a good run and control. The red knob is also Accy style as seen - but nothing stopping a customiser from adding a proper regulator handle should they want....


The regulator has been developed to make for a well-controlled loco. I'm told a quarter to half a turn will get the loco running and although the boiler is 40-50psi, it will run on 12-18psi quite well.

3)Frame construction
The loco which was seen at Warley was a prototype - NOT a final model. Another prototype is being build - see the cab. First photo shows the next model - its fold/construction is much tighter than the Nov 14 model.





Also, bufferbeams are being redesigned. They will finish bottom end flush with the black footplate/frame now and will be a 'T' shape - think like Edrig etc. The side holes will be riveted - but the main coupler will remain a nut/bolt to enable changability should an owner which to change coupling types.



The following photo also shows the steam system on the Nov 14 prototype.




4)Dimensions


First off - as many have wondered - comparison with a Mamod 1989 SL6. Longer than SL, wider than SL. Slightly taller.



The boiler will be 44mm diameter. The wheels - some people commented about how they seemed undersize. Bearing this in mind I was allowed to measure up. A Mamod SL wheel is 32mm diameter. The Telford wheels are 36mm. Also, new conrods are being made - the tiny little details that can make a difference.



5)Changes
Finally managed to establish, "word of God", why the extremely attractive "2012" 'Lynton-Barnstable look-a-like' body was changed. Photos see how the width was reduced on the two body designs.



It seems that the loco was somewhat topheavy and the centre of gravity was enough to make it keel over at speed on curves. The centre of gravity to do this was also why the footplate is recessed between the bufferbeams and cab which is a shame. Mamod reckon for a 45mm gauge loco it'd be fine but for 32mm it's teetering.



The lengthways centre of gravity is also why the wheels are not 'dead centre' in the length of the chassis. The boiler is a full steam vessel from end to end. When full, where the wheels are the weight is spread just about equally on both axles.

6)New Material
A separate model of tender is being built for the Telford range.



New frames are being designed for the locomotive as per the photo. These will be at least double the thickness of the old SL frames and thicker than Nov 14's prototype. This will add rigidity and weight to the loco. They also will be straight edged, no diagonal in them at the front.



7)Addendum
Mamod are keeping the whistle fitting, but are removing the lamp that has been on incarnations upto Nov 14. I suggested fitting lamp irons - it would allow further personal choice and add another edge towards making the locomotive more attractive to the garden railway set.

Mamod have also considered doing a batch in black as well as the customary green which could well be popular.

Looking promising, especially with the video released a few weeks ago.

[mikewakefielduk@btinterne]

Fingers crossed it all works well. I've already made a replacement steam regulator which should be far more sensitive so allowing me to fit a radio control servo with just 90 degrees of movement.

I had been hoping the back of the cab would be designed as coal bunker (think Accucraft Ragleth) but no worries. If I can't find anywhere else for the battery pack it can go in the new tender.

[bessytractor]

anyone else noticed the smokebox door is a Roundhouse Millie door?

[Chris Cairns]

anyone else noticed the smoke box door is a Roundhouse Millie door?

Only if Roundhouse get theirs supplied by Steam4Fun, as Mamod does.

Chris Cairns