Time to build a railway...but where?

A place for the discussion of garden railways and any garden style/scale portable and/or indoor layouts
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FWLR
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Re: Time to build a railway...but where?

Post by FWLR » Mon Feb 25, 2019 12:58 pm

I agree with you Rik. They must be in with a chance of Models Of The Year....

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Re: Time to build a railway...but where?

Post by Peter Butler » Mon Feb 25, 2019 8:13 pm

IanC wrote: Mon Feb 25, 2019 12:37 pm
Peter Butler wrote: Sun Feb 24, 2019 8:04 pm The only prototype for the layout was from imaginary cartoons by Emett himself and I tried to be faithful to them and give them the credit they deserved.
You might recall the large cartoon illustrations in the background (with publishers consent) to show where the influences originated.
I'd certainly love to see the layout again if it exists. If not, perhaps you could share some pictures on a thread on here?
As far as I am aware the layout still exist and is in the collection of Warley MRC who owned the original stock and set me the task of displaying it on a layout of my own design. I hope there will be opportunities to show it at exhibitions in the future but it is not to everyone's taste...... no layout ever could be!
I do have photographs, although on 35mm prints, so if I can copy some I will put on another thread.
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Re: Time to build a railway...but where?

Post by IanC » Mon Feb 25, 2019 10:29 pm

Peter Butler wrote: Mon Feb 25, 2019 8:13 pm
IanC wrote: Mon Feb 25, 2019 12:37 pm
Peter Butler wrote: Sun Feb 24, 2019 8:04 pm The only prototype for the layout was from imaginary cartoons by Emett himself and I tried to be faithful to them and give them the credit they deserved.
You might recall the large cartoon illustrations in the background (with publishers consent) to show where the influences originated.
I'd certainly love to see the layout again if it exists. If not, perhaps you could share some pictures on a thread on here?
As far as I am aware the layout still exist and is in the collection of Warley MRC who owned the original stock and set me the task of displaying it on a layout of my own design. I hope there will be opportunities to show it at exhibitions in the future but it is not to everyone's taste...... no layout ever could be!
I do have photographs, although on 35mm prints, so if I can copy some I will put on another thread.
Thank you Peter. Yes, no doubt the rivet counters and purists will be horrified, but I will enjoy it, and I wouldn't mind betting a lot of others will. Even if they won't admit it.
Ian

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Re: Time to build a railway...but where?

Post by FWLR » Tue Feb 26, 2019 8:00 am

I can't wait to see it Peter. I love a good layout and like IanC, I hope the rivet counters and the like get :protest: about it.

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Re: Time to build a railway...but where?

Post by Peter Butler » Sat Mar 02, 2019 7:33 pm

Now that my vertical boilered loco, 'Snail' has been reduced in scale I put the old driver figure next to the new one to see the difference. Looking at the picture it seems as though the larger one is superimposed but he really is standing next to the loco.......
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Quite a difference between the scales of my BURPS stock and the Emetts.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Time for something different.
Some years ago I installed two inclines for my disused stone quarry workings. Since then the ballast has gradually washed away down the slope revealing the underlay. It was time to fix the problem but the cause is the fact that dropping loose ballast on a slope and expecting it, and the SBR, to stay put is asking too much.
Time for a re-think on design options and the solution is to make the trackwork and ballast on a flat, horizontal surface first and then apply to the incline when finished. So a black, 1mm thick HIP sheet was cut to size and the track laid on long, raised strips of HIP sleeper strip which was grained, painted and weathered.....
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As can be seen, the HIP has been scored to give the SBR a 'key' and mix of fine ballast and waterproof cement applied and well soaked in neat SBR and left to dry.....
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Looks alarming when it is wet but will dry clear.... eventually!
The two sites for the bases, when ready, look like this and they just slide down on top......
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Re: Time to build a railway...but where?

Post by steamgeorge » Sat Mar 02, 2019 7:47 pm

That wood effect looks amazing! I've always struggled replicating aged wood. What does your paint palette include for creating that effect?

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Re: Time to build a railway...but where?

Post by Peter Butler » Sat Mar 02, 2019 9:27 pm

Thanks George, the effect I create for aged wood has been covered somewhere back in my thread but briefly the main concern is to make the material (HIP) look like it has a grain. This is done with a razor saw scraped sideways along the length with additional deep scratches done with a Stanley blade, again sideways. After a light sanding I spray grey primer and allow to dry. In this instance I have dry brushed with Citadel acrylic paint (Dryad Bark) to show highlights and after drying a wash coat of Agrax Earthshade to settle in the grooves. I find this works well and can be enhanced with other colours if you want to alter the tone.
I use only Citadel acrylic paints for all my buildings and much of my stock...... The paint is of the highest quality and has dense pigment and will withstand being left outside in all weathers for many years......
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Other wood effects could look like these.....
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Re: Time to build a railway...but where?

Post by steamgeorge » Sun Mar 03, 2019 7:59 pm

Thank you for sharing :thumbright:

George

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Re: Time to build a railway...but where?

Post by ge_rik » Mon Mar 04, 2019 9:58 am

Yes, thanks for the reminder, Peter. I, too have never been able to simulate weathered wood. I've now ordered the paints and will give it a try. Though, no doubt, there's a touch of Butler Magic also required.

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Re: Time to build a railway...but where?

Post by philipy » Mon Mar 04, 2019 10:12 am

"Me too", Rik!
I've also just discovered that there is a Games Workshop shop in Banbury, only a couple of minutes walk from "The Works", so may be it will be worth atrip in the not too distant future, after all.
Philip

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Re: Time to build a railway...but where?

Post by philipy » Wed Mar 06, 2019 12:26 pm

Peter Butler wrote: Sat Mar 02, 2019 9:27 pm
I use only Citadel acrylic paints for all my buildings and much of my stock...... The paint is of the highest quality and has dense pigment and will withstand being left outside in all weathers for many years......
Peter,
I just bought some of those two paints from Games Workshop to do some experimenting. The very pleasant guy in the shop asked what I was doing with it and when I told him it was for a garden railway he suggested that it would be essential to give it a top coat of weather resistant varnish. The implication of your post is that you've never found that necessary?
Philip

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Re: Time to build a railway...but where?

Post by Peter Butler » Wed Mar 06, 2019 3:35 pm

Philip,
as I said in my description, my structures have withstood the wet and windy conditions here for several years in some cases and I have not found it necessary to use a varnish. The structures made of HIP have stood up far better than the resin ones, which often show signs of the paint peeling..... I can't see how a lacquer would prevent that as the paint is simply not bonding to the material, not being worn or washed off.
On one building only I did apply a spray coat of clear matt lacquer to the roof which is unpainted black HIP. This is now showing signs of the lacquer allowing water underneath the surface and a change of colour. I imagine the movement of the roof 'slates' in the changing conditions is letting water in, but not out again?
I have no doubt the shop assistant is very knowledgeable on his subject of the paints when used as intended, however, I doubt he has any experience of them being used outdoors.
The paints are made in such a way that a skin forms on the surface which remains flexible but waterproof, personally I would not recommend sealing the surface with anything.
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Re: Time to build a railway...but where?

Post by philipy » Wed Mar 06, 2019 3:44 pm

Ok, thanks Peter. My thoughts were along those lines too, but the confirmation is worth having.
Philip

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Re: Time to build a railway...but where?

Post by philipy » Mon Mar 18, 2019 11:12 am

Peter Butler wrote: Sat Mar 02, 2019 9:27 pm After a light sanding I spray grey primer and allow to dry. In this instance I have dry brushed with Citadel acrylic paint (Dryad Bark) to show highlights and after drying a wash coat of Agrax Earthshade to settle in the grooves.
Peter, I think I'm in need of a Butler MasterClass.

I've followed your notes, as exactly as I could, but it seems to have come out a very even dark brownish colour all over, not quite the worn wood effect I was after.

Both sprayed with Halfords grey primer.
Both given a rough dry brush of Dryad Bark .
Bottom one given a wash of Agrax Earthshade - used neat from the bottle, should it be diluted?
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Re: Time to build a railway...but where?

Post by ge_rik » Mon Mar 18, 2019 12:44 pm

philipy wrote: Mon Mar 18, 2019 11:12 am
Peter Butler wrote: Sat Mar 02, 2019 9:27 pm After a light sanding I spray grey primer and allow to dry. In this instance I have dry brushed with Citadel acrylic paint (Dryad Bark) to show highlights and after drying a wash coat of Agrax Earthshade to settle in the grooves.
Peter, I think I'm in need of a Butler MasterClass.

I've followed your notes, as exactly as I could, but it seems to have come out a very even dark brownish colour all over, not quite the worn wood effect I was after.

Both sprayed with Halfords grey primer.
Both given a rough dry brush of Dryad Bark .
Bottom one given a wash of Agrax Earthshade - used neat from the bottle, should it be diluted?

DSC_0001.JPG
I'm glad it's not just me. I had a go as well and ended up with similar results. I think Peter has magic fingers.

Rik
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Re: Time to build a railway...but where?

Post by Andrew » Mon Mar 18, 2019 12:54 pm

I reckon they're looking pretty good, especially the top one!

I've never used that type of paint, but dilution might be the answer - weathered wood's often pretty pale, almost a silvery grey. It's a look I've tried to achieve several times, with mixed success - I thought I'd got it on my Swift Sixteen bogie well-wagon, using a very pale base colour with several thin layers of colour to represent ageing and bring out the grain, but was told that the wood still looked too "new"...

Good luck!

Andrew.

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Re: Time to build a railway...but where?

Post by philipy » Mon Mar 18, 2019 1:42 pm

ge_rik wrote: Mon Mar 18, 2019 12:44 pm
I'm glad it's not just me. I had a go as well and ended up with similar results. I think Peter has magic fingers.

Rik
In which case I'm also glad it's not just me! :lol:
I think I may know the problem. The all over brown effect that I've ended up with, is actually not too disimilar to Peter's incline sleepers, which is where this discussion started. However I was really after something along the lines of Peter's bolster wagons, although perhaps not quite as yellow. So I've had a play with another vehicle and mixed up a kind of khaki to use as the base colour, with the Agrax Earthshade on top, and it looks a lot closer. My DIY mix has got too much yellow in it, but it shows I'm thinking in the right direction. Not good enough to put a picture up though.
Dependant on what Peter says when he sees this, I think another trip to Games Workshop to find a suitable base colour is in order. Selecting colour isn't really something you can do online and anyway its as cheap to pay GW shop prices as ebay+postage.
Philip

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Re: Time to build a railway...but where?

Post by Peter Butler » Mon Mar 18, 2019 11:08 pm

I would never criticise anyone's work or attempt to tell others how to do it, I can only offer suggestions as to what works for me and how I achieved it. If nothing else, it is clear I would never have succeeded in teaching! There will be no..... 'How to Garden Railway' publication anytime soon!
However, now you have offered the pictures Phillipy, my guess is that the graining effect could be more enhanced to show greater contrast between the colours and possibly the 'dry' brush was not dry enough? Your second picture seems to have achieved both of the techniques better than the first. Colour is something personal to you and represents the nature of the environment. It does take a little practise to get the effect and it seems that more paint is on the paper towel than on the model itself, but that is how to achieve the best finish.
I don't dilute any of the acrylic paints, or the wash.
Hope this helps.
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Re: Time to build a railway...but where?

Post by Peter Butler » Sat Mar 30, 2019 10:21 pm

Not much happening on the garden railway at the moment other than general cleaning and maintenance. The buildings which have been in the shed throughout the winter months have had a wash and brush-up, although very little required to any of the HIP structures. The resin ones need a little more paintwork but are all in good order.
Some weeding and gentle brushing away of dead leaves etc. is ongoing and freeing off points which seem to have become jammed with loose ballast. Now the longer days are approaching I will spend more time preparing to run some trains again.
In the meantime our group have begun the annual exhibition programme, displaying our models at the National Botanical Gardens of Wales and the Heritage Centre, Pembroke Dock.......
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.
Not all railway models but a total of sixty linear feet of displays at one of the venues.
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Re: Time to build a railway...but where?

Post by FWLR » Thu Apr 04, 2019 9:49 am

This is how I do my Plasticard with the help of Peter's sample he had.

This is what I use for my card.
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Then I paint it with grey paint. I try to put it on with one stroke if possible, though depending on the length, one will end up with darker patches, but sometimes it works well with them.

!st Coat,
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The following are different shades depending on how many coats you put on and how, don't be to heavy handed with the amount of paint on your brush. I try to put a little bit on a flat brush and then brush it out going down the piece I am working on.


Forgot to rotate this one.... :roll: :roll:
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You can see how much darker it gets.

Now for what ever colour I want to use. Different shades going darker with the grey I put on. Although by experimenting with the amount of coats you can achieve the same shades with just how much you put on with the first coat of grey and the colour of your choice...
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I hope this helps in some way, it all trial and error really, but if you take your time and be careful with what ever colour your using, you can achieve similar results to Peter's.....Hopefully.... :lol: :lol:

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