Ludwig Gross Betriebe Werkslok battery conversion

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mymodeltrain
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Ludwig Gross Betriebe Werkslok battery conversion

Post by mymodeltrain » Mon Mar 08, 2021 1:43 am

I tried to open up the LGB Ludwig Gross Betriebe Werkslok locomotive so I can have direct access to the motor for conversion to battery-run. However, I found it is very challenging; if someone has some photos of how to do this please share them with me. Meanwhile, I am certain that the socket behind the locomotive is modulated by a circuit design that does not have a direct connection to the motor.

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Re: Ludwig Gross Betriebe Werkslok battery conversion

Post by ge_rik » Mon Mar 08, 2021 8:05 am

I don't have any experience of that particular loco, but I have converted a Stainz loco using the socket on the back. Although the socket was connected to the onboard circuit board, it did feed directly to the motor.

I have no idea how your loco is wired up. It might be worthwhile connecting a volt meter to the socket and see what sort of output you get while the motor is being run. If the voltage varies directly with the speed there's a good chance it's wired up like the Stainz.

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Re: Ludwig Gross Betriebe Werkslok battery conversion

Post by mymodeltrain » Mon Mar 08, 2021 2:59 pm

ge_rik wrote:
Mon Mar 08, 2021 8:05 am
I don't have any experience of that particular loco, but I have converted a Stainz loco using the socket on the back. Although the socket was connected to the onboard circuit board, it did feed directly to the motor.

I have no idea how your loco is wired up. It might be worthwhile connecting a volt meter to the socket and see what sort of output you get while the motor is being run. If the voltage varies directly with the speed there's a good chance it's wired up like the Stainz.

Rik
Hi Rik,
Yes, the socket in the Stainz locomotive has a direct connection to the motor, but not this one. In one experiment, I connected the socket to the remote control system, the locomotive didn't run smoothly. It seems the electricity is being modulated through the internal circuit board. And then to test whether that socket has a direct connection to the motor, I inserted a direct line from an LGB power line to the socket, the motor didn't run and the locomotive has very dim light. It may explain that the socket does not directly link to the motor but rather modulated through a circuit board. It could be used for lights but not for powering the locomotive. That is why I tried to open it up to find a direct connection to the motor to test my hypothesis.

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Re: Ludwig Gross Betriebe Werkslok battery conversion

Post by thornmini » Mon Mar 08, 2021 4:59 pm

Your engine is an LGB 20620. If you want to see a blow up diagram of all your engines parts, it may help in locating the points/places you want to disassemble. To see those diagrams go to "trainli.com" and look at their LGB Parts PDF's. Then scroll down to your engine number "20620" and click on it. Hope it helps and welcome to the forum. Mike
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Re: Ludwig Gross Betriebe Werkslok battery conversion

Post by ge_rik » Mon Mar 08, 2021 7:34 pm

thornmini wrote:
Mon Mar 08, 2021 4:59 pm
Your engine is an LGB 20620. If you want to see a blow up diagram of all your engines parts, it may help in locating the points/places you want to disassemble. To see those diagrams go to "trainli.com" and look at their LGB Parts PDF's. Then scroll down to your engine number "20620" and click on it. Hope it helps and welcome to the forum. Mike
Thanks Mike
The exploded circuit diagram is not particularly helpful. The wiring to the socket mirrors the wiring to the motor block in terms of colour coding which would imply that two of the terminals ought to connect to the motor - or maybe not?
LGB20620 wiring.png

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Re: Ludwig Gross Betriebe Werkslok battery conversion

Post by mymodeltrain » Mon Mar 08, 2021 10:01 pm

thornmini wrote:
Mon Mar 08, 2021 4:59 pm
Your engine is an LGB 20620. If you want to see a blow up diagram of all your engines parts, it may help in locating the points/places you want to disassemble. To see those diagrams go to "trainli.com" and look at their LGB Parts PDF's. Then scroll down to your engine number "20620" and click on it. Hope it helps and welcome to the forum. Mike
Great idea, thanks. I went to the site; the file offers some clues for me to start with.

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Re: Ludwig Gross Betriebe Werkslok battery conversion

Post by Phil.P » Tue Mar 09, 2021 12:10 pm

This loco appears from the linked diagram to have a 3-wire motor - block.
This means that on one side the motor and track connections are tied together within the motor-block.

You would normally isolate the motor and track connections from each other.
This means adding an extra wire for the second motor connection.


Apologies if this is an insult to your knowledge-level.

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Re: Ludwig Gross Betriebe Werkslok battery conversion

Post by mymodeltrain » Tue Mar 09, 2021 1:14 pm

Phil.P wrote:
Tue Mar 09, 2021 12:10 pm
This loco appears from the linked diagram to have a 3-wire motor - block.
This means that on one side the motor and track connections are tied together within the motor-block.

You would normally isolate the motor and track connections from each other.
This means adding an extra wire for the second motor connection.


Apologies if this is an insult to your knowledge-level.

Phil.P
Thanks all for the information. From the PDF file, I could pry to open the panel in front of the locomotive. From there I could see the motor block, and most important to see where the screws that hold the frame to the chassis.
Ludwig Gross Bitriebe1.jpg
It turns out the screws are blocked from view by the wheels. Basically, the wheels need to be removed first before we can have access to the screws and removing the motor block.
Ludwig Gross Bitriebe2.jpg
As Phil said there are 3 wires on the motor block, white and green are for the motor, and brown is not connected to the motor, so I assume as Phil said, for the track connection.
Now, I soldered wires that link to the motor and connected them to the remote control system. The locomotive runs smoothly now. It's a good experience, thanks.

This is the video after appropriate wiring, it runs smoothly.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XaIS6_5pEM0
Last edited by mymodeltrain on Fri Mar 26, 2021 1:08 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Ludwig Gross Betriebe Werkslok battery conversion

Post by Phil.P » Tue Mar 09, 2021 2:19 pm

Sorry, don't know your name?

Have you connected wires directly to the motor, and have bypassed all the other wiring?

I ask as the LGB wiring convention is that white and brown are track, and green and yellow are motor.

You do not want any connection's to the wheels or skates (if fitted). - You do not want power to get from the track into the loco, or your battery-power to get out to the track.

Phil.P

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Re: Ludwig Gross Betriebe Werkslok battery conversion

Post by mymodeltrain » Tue Mar 09, 2021 3:34 pm

Phil.P wrote:
Tue Mar 09, 2021 2:19 pm
Sorry, don't know your name?

Have you connected wires directly to the motor, and have bypassed all the other wiring?

I ask as the LGB wiring convention is that white and brown are track, and green and yellow are motor.

You do not want any connection's to the wheels or skates (if fitted). - You do not want power to get from the track into the loco, or your battery-power to get out to the track.

Phil.P
Hi Phil, I am Wellington.
I connected the power wires from my ESC/remot control system to the motor and all of the skates and connection related to the track have been removed. This is probably my 12th locomotive that I wired for battery-run.

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Re: Ludwig Gross Betriebe Werkslok battery conversion

Post by mymodeltrain » Tue Mar 09, 2021 3:37 pm

mymodeltrain wrote:
Tue Mar 09, 2021 3:34 pm
Phil.P wrote:
Tue Mar 09, 2021 2:19 pm
Sorry, don't know your name?

Have you connected wires directly to the motor, and have bypassed all the other wiring?

I ask as the LGB wiring convention is that white and brown are track, and green and yellow are motor.

You do not want any connection's to the wheels or skates (if fitted). - You do not want power to get from the track into the loco, or your battery-power to get out to the track.

Phil.P
Hi Phil, I am Wellington.
I connected the power wires from my ESC/remote control system to the motor and all of the skates and connection related to the track have been removed. This is probably my 12th locomotive that I wired for battery-run.

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